Topic: Poor people should be banned from debt
Anonymous A started this discussion 7 years ago #85,825
If you're poor, no income or low income you should be banned from all debt. No credit cards, no loans no mortgage and no car finance. Furthermore, if you're poor your bills should be capped through usage. So for example your power bills are capped at $xxx worth of fuel so once you've used that much you're cut off forcing yourself to budget and better yourself.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 31 minutes later[^] [v] #983,285
Do you have any other bad ideas you'd like to share with the forum?
Mrs.Kate Gerard joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 13 minutes later, 44 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #983,286
Yes the people will choose to stop being poor then
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 22 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #983,287
@983,285 (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
How is it a bad idea? Poor people are made to be poorer by debt and living beyond their means. It also means more consumerism which is harming the planet.
How is it a bad idea? Poor people are made to be poorer by debt and living beyond their means. It also means more consumerism which is harming the planet.
Anonymous A (OP) double-posted this 7 years ago, 1 minute later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #983,288
@983,286 (Mrs.Kate Gerard)
It will make them better themselves. Rather than go to college and get into huge debt learning gender studies they might learn a trade or farm
It will make them better themselves. Rather than go to college and get into huge debt learning gender studies they might learn a trade or farm
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU replied with this 7 years ago, 17 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #983,289
@983,287 (A)
Why is turning off poor people's power and heat in the middle of winter bad? Idk that's a real head scratcher.
Why is turning off poor people's power and heat in the middle of winter bad? Idk that's a real head scratcher.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 12 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #983,290
@previous (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
Why do you have to go to extremes? Obviously a regulation could be put in place where their fuel is rationed but if they did end up blowing their allowance so soon then maybe they need to be retaught how to budget.
Why do you have to go to extremes? Obviously a regulation could be put in place where their fuel is rationed but if they did end up blowing their allowance so soon then maybe they need to be retaught how to budget.
Anonymous D joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 2 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #983,291
@983,289 (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
It's bad because they will jump under the covers together and end up creating several pregnancies throughout the winter season.
Then the taxpayers will have to pay for abortions.
One possible solution would be to give them mandatory injections that would cause extreme projectile vomiting and explosive diarrhea upon orgasm.
It's bad because they will jump under the covers together and end up creating several pregnancies throughout the winter season.
Then the taxpayers will have to pay for abortions.
One possible solution would be to give them mandatory injections that would cause extreme projectile vomiting and explosive diarrhea upon orgasm.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU replied with this 7 years ago, 1 minute later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #983,292
@983,290 (A)
Why would you start from a place of wanting to punish the poor for being poor though? Why not offer constructive ways to help get them out of poverty? The whole framework sucks.
Why would you start from a place of wanting to punish the poor for being poor though? Why not offer constructive ways to help get them out of poverty? The whole framework sucks.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 5 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #983,296
@previous (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
Punishing the poor is offering pay-day loans with high interest rates, offering easy credit then sending the bailiffs round the second they default. I know there is a certain group of God's chosen people who benefit from loaning money to those who struggle to pay it back but putting them aside if we can, the poor will be much better off if they are denied loans until such a time that they can afford to pay money back and live within their means.
Punishing the poor is offering pay-day loans with high interest rates, offering easy credit then sending the bailiffs round the second they default. I know there is a certain group of God's chosen people who benefit from loaning money to those who struggle to pay it back but putting them aside if we can, the poor will be much better off if they are denied loans until such a time that they can afford to pay money back and live within their means.
Socialist Sam replied with this 7 years ago, 12 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #983,301
The simple solution is to take 1/3 of the wealth of the closest affluent neighbors of the couple and give it to the disadvantaged folks.
Problem solved, correct?
Problem solved, correct?
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU replied with this 7 years ago, 20 seconds later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,302
@983,296 (A)
Where did I say I like payday loans or predatory lenders? People's expenses do not automatically line up with their income. When there's a mismatch you need to be able to take out loans. If your car breaks down and you need $500 to fix it, but you only have $50 in savings until your next paycheck, you need some access to credit or you will lose your job and be pushed even deeper into poverty. The fact that some poor people ruin their finances via debt doesn't mean poor people can't be trusted to use credit responsibly as a whole.
Where did I say I like payday loans or predatory lenders? People's expenses do not automatically line up with their income. When there's a mismatch you need to be able to take out loans. If your car breaks down and you need $500 to fix it, but you only have $50 in savings until your next paycheck, you need some access to credit or you will lose your job and be pushed even deeper into poverty. The fact that some poor people ruin their finances via debt doesn't mean poor people can't be trusted to use credit responsibly as a whole.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU double-posted this 7 years ago, 1 minute later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,303
@983,301 (Socialist Sam)
1/3rd seems low, I'd like something like 40-50% if they're multimillionaires, but yeah that sounds good to me.
1/3rd seems low, I'd like something like 40-50% if they're multimillionaires, but yeah that sounds good to me.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 2 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,305
@983,302 (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
We just need a new way of thinking and behaviour. More people would need to car pool or use public transport or work closer to home so they don't need to rely of an old unreliable car. We need a new era of cooperation between the poor so they are able to live on what they make and look up to the middle class for inspiration.
We just need a new way of thinking and behaviour. More people would need to car pool or use public transport or work closer to home so they don't need to rely of an old unreliable car. We need a new era of cooperation between the poor so they are able to live on what they make and look up to the middle class for inspiration.
Anonymous A (OP) double-posted this 7 years ago, 1 minute later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,307
@983,301 (Socialist Sam)
They would just end up putting it back into the hands of the rich as they by flashy cars with spinning wheel hubs and expensive holidays. In the end they are poor again and the environment is even more damaged.
They would just end up putting it back into the hands of the rich as they by flashy cars with spinning wheel hubs and expensive holidays. In the end they are poor again and the environment is even more damaged.
Anonymous D replied with this 7 years ago, 4 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,308
@previous (A)
Perhaps the State using random executions might be a good idea.
Nothing extreme but maybe like once every six months.
Something needs to happen to force these slackers to become woke.
As an incentive for opting in to the Program poor people could be persuaded to sign a waiver against prosecution of the Government by giving them a 5000 tax credit, thus eliminating any legal concerns.
Perhaps the State using random executions might be a good idea.
Nothing extreme but maybe like once every six months.
Something needs to happen to force these slackers to become woke.
As an incentive for opting in to the Program poor people could be persuaded to sign a waiver against prosecution of the Government by giving them a 5000 tax credit, thus eliminating any legal concerns.
(Edited 5 minutes later.)
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU replied with this 7 years ago, 4 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,309
@983,305 (A)
The car thing is just an example of an unplanned expense. It could be a heater breaking or a medical emergency or a robbery or any number of things. If you are living paycheck to paycheck you need access to credit or you will quickly go from being poor to bring homeless, jobless and poor.
> W need a new era of cooperation between the poor so they are able to live on what they make and look up to the middle class for inspiration.
I don't think treating them like children who just need positive role models in their life to magically make them want to not be poor is helpful. Poor people don't want to be poor. No one wants to be poor. Being poor sucks. Things that help people actually, materially increase the amount of money, employment opportunity, or education they have are good. Anything else is a waste of everyone's time. You want to do the opposite.
The car thing is just an example of an unplanned expense. It could be a heater breaking or a medical emergency or a robbery or any number of things. If you are living paycheck to paycheck you need access to credit or you will quickly go from being poor to bring homeless, jobless and poor.
> W need a new era of cooperation between the poor so they are able to live on what they make and look up to the middle class for inspiration.
I don't think treating them like children who just need positive role models in their life to magically make them want to not be poor is helpful. Poor people don't want to be poor. No one wants to be poor. Being poor sucks. Things that help people actually, materially increase the amount of money, employment opportunity, or education they have are good. Anything else is a waste of everyone's time. You want to do the opposite.
Anonymous D replied with this 7 years ago, 2 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,311
@previous (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
EVERYBODY wants a paycheck.
Very few relish the idea of performing hard work to earn it.
EVERYBODY wants a paycheck.
Very few relish the idea of performing hard work to earn it.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU replied with this 7 years ago, 6 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,312
@previous (D)
I've been unemployed and I am very lazy. By the end of my second week of unemployment I would have set an orphanage on fire if it meant I got a job out of it. Working sucks but not as much as unemployment.
I've been unemployed and I am very lazy. By the end of my second week of unemployment I would have set an orphanage on fire if it meant I got a job out of it. Working sucks but not as much as unemployment.
Anonymous E joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 5 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,313
Joshy eats peepee.
Anonymous F joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 15 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,315
@983,312 (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
Yes we know that you technically not a virgin.
But someone who has never built more than a cardboard box fort is not a house builder.
Yes we know that you technically not a virgin.
But someone who has never built more than a cardboard box fort is not a house builder.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU replied with this 7 years ago, 17 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,320
Meta !Sober//iZs joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 1 hour later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,334
Just outlaw poverty
Anonymous H joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 12 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,335
2 years credit-free and I'm still as broke as ever. However what I'm not doing is paying £800 a month on a £1300 salary so I'm staying afloat. Coming out of this month with about £180 in my bank.
Anonymous I joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 1 minute later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,336
@previous (H)
Do you worry about £180 being of less value as Brexit continues to bring the pound down in value?
Do you worry about £180 being of less value as Brexit continues to bring the pound down in value?
Anonymous H replied with this 7 years ago, 2 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,338
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 1 hour later, 5 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,357
@previous (H)
If there are food shortages due to brexit you watch all those middle eastern and Asian immigrants go home.
If there are food shortages due to brexit you watch all those middle eastern and Asian immigrants go home.
Anonymous H replied with this 7 years ago, 5 minutes later, 5 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,358
Anonymous J joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 4 minutes later, 5 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,359
@983,357 (A)
Middle eastern immigrants can subsist on cheap forms of lentils-beans and rice.
All Asians need is rice and what people toss away.
Middle eastern immigrants can subsist on cheap forms of lentils-beans and rice.
All Asians need is rice and what people toss away.
Mr.Frank Johnson joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 9 minutes later, 6 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,364
@previous (J)> Middle eastern immigrants can subsist on cheap forms of lentils-beans and rice.
> All Asians need is rice and what people toss away.
> I'm not racist!
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 23 minutes later, 6 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,369
Anonymous H replied with this 7 years ago, 21 minutes later, 6 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,381
@previous (A)
We can do all that by giving my local council a proper budget instead of all the cuts.
We can do all that by giving my local council a proper budget instead of all the cuts.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 7 minutes later, 7 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,382
@previous (H)
Cuts are necessary but we can lower crime and clean up our communities with our superior culture.
Cuts are necessary but we can lower crime and clean up our communities with our superior culture.
Anonymous H replied with this 7 years ago, 5 minutes later, 7 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,384
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 2 minutes later, 7 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,385
Anonymous H replied with this 7 years ago, 1 minute later, 7 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,386
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 37 seconds later, 7 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,387
Anonymous D replied with this 7 years ago, 25 minutes later, 7 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,394
Anonymous H replied with this 7 years ago, 1 hour later, 9 hours after the original post[^] [v] #983,404
Mr.Frank Johnson replied with this 7 years ago, 20 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #983,672
@983,387 (A)
> Actually by quitting smoking your health will improve so really you're gaining.
wow ok Hitler
> Actually by quitting smoking your health will improve so really you're gaining.
wow ok Hitler
Anonymous D replied with this 7 years ago, 4 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #983,723
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 6 years ago, 3 months later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,051
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U joined in and replied with this 6 years ago, 54 minutes later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,064
@OP
> If you're poor, no income or low income you should be banned from all debt. No credit cards, no loans no mortgage and no car finance. Furthermore, if you're poor your bills should be capped through usage. So for example your power bills are capped at $xxx worth of fuel so once you've used that much you're cut off forcing yourself to budget and better yourself.
Does this include the United States of America, whose national debt currently stands at over 22 and a half trillion dollars?
https://www.usdebtclock.org/
> If you're poor, no income or low income you should be banned from all debt. No credit cards, no loans no mortgage and no car finance. Furthermore, if you're poor your bills should be capped through usage. So for example your power bills are capped at $xxx worth of fuel so once you've used that much you're cut off forcing yourself to budget and better yourself.
Does this include the United States of America, whose national debt currently stands at over 22 and a half trillion dollars?
https://www.usdebtclock.org/
Big Daddy Derek !Uvm54ORbmo joined in and replied with this 6 years ago, 6 minutes later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,065
@OP
@983,288 (A)
This has always been one of the laughably naive beliefs of conservatism, that the poor can be bullied out of being poor if the state is cruel enough to them.
@983,288 (A)
This has always been one of the laughably naive beliefs of conservatism, that the poor can be bullied out of being poor if the state is cruel enough to them.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 6 years ago, 36 minutes later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,067
@previous (Big Daddy Derek !Uvm54ORbmo)
I dont believe you can be bullied out of poverty. Some people are just poor but they can be poor without crippling debt.
@1,019,064 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
This only applies to the individual
I dont believe you can be bullied out of poverty. Some people are just poor but they can be poor without crippling debt.
@1,019,064 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
This only applies to the individual
Anonymous N joined in and replied with this 6 years ago, 2 minutes later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,068
@OP
Good idea, but even better would be to ban stupid or irresponsible people from getting access to credit.
Good idea, but even better would be to ban stupid or irresponsible people from getting access to credit.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 6 years ago, 9 minutes later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,071
@1,019,067 (A)
> This only applies to the individual
Why? What about the economics of debt changes if we apply caps only to individuals?
> This only applies to the individual
Why? What about the economics of debt changes if we apply caps only to individuals?
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 6 years ago, 10 minutes later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,076
@previous (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
Countries can not be banned from debt because debt is money and there is more debt than cash.
Countries can not be banned from debt because debt is money and there is more debt than cash.
Anonymous I replied with this 6 years ago, 3 minutes later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,077
terri !RwordOooFE replied with this 6 years ago, 40 minutes later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,099
haha great New idea: boots with straps so you can just pull em on
Anonymous O joined in and replied with this 6 years ago, 7 hours later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,387
@OP and everyone else:
Our economy is based on debt, most of which is incurred by low income families and individuals. If they weren't allowed to take out loans, the economy would go into recession. Counter-intuitive but true.
Our economy is based on debt, most of which is incurred by low income families and individuals. If they weren't allowed to take out loans, the economy would go into recession. Counter-intuitive but true.
Anonymous I replied with this 6 years ago, 6 minutes later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,392
@previous (O)
What is not counterintuitive is that people may stop paying off debt if they run out of money or go bankrupt,
In USA case WE are forced to sell Bonds to bring in cold hard cash. Countries that buy these bonds do so in order to earn interest - Trump in one of his many dumb moments thought US could just forfeit and discount those loans (bonds) then found out such is impossible.
And you have this unfortunate matter.
What is not counterintuitive is that people may stop paying off debt if they run out of money or go bankrupt,
In USA case WE are forced to sell Bonds to bring in cold hard cash. Countries that buy these bonds do so in order to earn interest - Trump in one of his many dumb moments thought US could just forfeit and discount those loans (bonds) then found out such is impossible.
And you have this unfortunate matter.
The interest on the national debt is how much the federal government must pay on outstanding public debt each year. The interest on the debt is $479 billion. That's from the federal budget for fiscal year 2020 that runs from October 1, 2019, through September 30, 2020.
(Edited 40 seconds later.)
Anonymous O replied with this 6 years ago, 5 minutes later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,398
@previous (I)
> people may stop paying off debt if they run out of money or go bankrupt
Even the wealthy can run out of money or go bankrupt.
> people may stop paying off debt if they run out of money or go bankrupt
Even the wealthy can run out of money or go bankrupt.
Anonymous I replied with this 6 years ago, 17 minutes later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,414
@previous (O)
> Even the wealthy can run out of money or go bankrupt.
Not exactly. Take Trump. He sets up multiple entities as LLC's etc. He went bankrupt a number of times but in ways the rest of his real money was protected.
> Even the wealthy can run out of money or go bankrupt.
Not exactly. Take Trump. He sets up multiple entities as LLC's etc. He went bankrupt a number of times but in ways the rest of his real money was protected.
Anonymous O replied with this 6 years ago, 1 hour later, 3 months after the original post[^] [v] #1,019,444
@previous (I)
But the wealthy can still go bankrupt, and they stand to lose more than the average worker.
But the wealthy can still go bankrupt, and they stand to lose more than the average worker.
(Edited 1 minute later.)