Anonymous A started this discussion 7 years ago#83,561
You know what reconciles the bad and the good in humanity? God, of course. How else are you supposed to reconcile the good and bad in yourself and people as a whole, if not by believing we are at least worthy of the care from God?
Anonymous C joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 3 minutes later, 9 minutes after the original post[^][v]#961,501
OP
Do you also believe in the Tooth Fairy. Oh and how come Gods bible has no dinosaurs.
Also how come God started man off with incest. Just does not seem the right thing to do.
Oh and how come a woman has her delightful Vagina just fractions of an inch from her sewage outlet.
And this worthy care from God. Can you explain Cancer. I mean if Man is really made in God's image then that means God has Cancer.
Anonymous B replied with this 7 years ago, 1 minute later, 11 minutes after the original post[^][v]#961,502
@961,500 (A)
Recognize your mistakes and try to improve. Accept that you may err and that others may do the same. Work to learn from your experiences and try to offer that experience to others when they might need it. It's really not that hard. It's pretty basic shit if you're at all introspective about your life.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 11 seconds later, 11 minutes after the original post[^][v]#961,503
I think this is naive though. The cruelty of men can make a lasting impression. To decide to just improve is a noble thing and all, but is it not also a form of ignoring your other side which isn't up to standards? I mean for example, I might have gone and punched a old lady in drunken madness, one doesn't just brusg it off and say you'll improve.
Anonymous C replied with this 7 years ago, 7 minutes later, 22 minutes after the original post[^][v]#961,509
@961,503 (A)
Science is good. Facts are good.
What pisses me off and I am being serious. Before them Jews, there were wonderful Gods and deities. Romans and Greeks. Gods the Native American Indians had and those Hindu Gods and deities just to many to count.
To complicate your God, a pretender to the throne comes along (Another disenchanted Jew) and tells everyone you have to use him as some kind of go to God to connect with his father who he said was God. I mean his mother gets knocked up and tells her husband she is still a virgin.
Anyway you can see why I am somewhat amused at the idea there is just one God when the Greeks need so many.
Anonymous B replied with this 7 years ago, 39 seconds later, 23 minutes after the original post[^][v]#961,510
@961,505 (A)
I'm not advocating just brushing off problems. To improve you make amends or at least try to right a wrong you've done. That's part of being responsible. I can work to encourage responsibility in myself and urge others to the same. Maybe when I wrong someone I need to have that pointed out to me by others in order to improve. This happens all the time already. No deity required.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 10 minutes later, 33 minutes after the original post[^][v]#961,516
That's very basic and I understand that. My point though is when you just try to improve, what do you make of the situation that has you having to make amends? I guess it might make one feel not so perfect, too much of that and you can even feel like a absolute monster. That's what needs to be reconciled, how do you deal with being a monster?
Anonymous B replied with this 7 years ago, 38 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#961,519
@previous (A)
You try to improve and do what you can to correct any mistakes you may have made along the way. You can't undo time. All you can do is seek to live better. I think identifying the mistakes and acknowledging them is probably the hardest part, especially when they are your mistakes. Most people I've known will try not to cause anyone undue hardship because it's usually the easiest and most rewarding path. I think it's safe to say that people want to loved rather than hated, generally.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 14 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#961,525
I agree, what could help that process is the reconciliation of good and evil. Picture someone trying to figure out if people and himself are good or evil? Normally, people would easily conclude that there's some evil but mostly good but if you've been very unlucky, you might conclude that we are mostly evil. This is where a benevolent deity comes into the picture. As something separate from people, the benevolent deity keeps the idea of a good world alive because if people are evil instead of good, what else can be good enough to counter the evilness in people?
Anonymous B replied with this 7 years ago, 21 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#961,531
@previous (A)
Except the benevolent deity isn't really in the picture. It's just an idea about a benevolent deity. It's not separate from people at all because it couldn't exist without them. The concept of a benevolent deity in the popular imagination is just as prone to change as concepts of good and evil might be.
I think ideas about right and wrong are pretty simple. Children can figure them out pretty quickly. It's noble that you think we can preserve old ideas by believing in more old ideas, but I don't agree with the solution. Trying to add extra layers of conceptual backstop to the problem of defining good and evil only obfuscates the issues rather than helps clarify them. To some extent it's better that each age figure this out for themselves rather than adhere dogmatically to rules without any understanding. We can put a little thought into our lives and do this by ourselves for ourselves. We can leave the deities out of it. They'll be free to drink nectar and have gardens without having to worry about us anymore.
Anonymous D joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 1 minute later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#961,534
I like how Denmark threads are immediately recognizable since he always starts a topic with the most inane questions imaginable
(Edited 16 seconds later.)
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 9 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#961,537
I wasn't saying we should all do this and follow it through dogma. Neither was i saying we should preserve old ideas. What is it that you are saying though? You say people should figure it out for themselves, figure what out exactly and what's so wrong about them figuring it out through religion or spirituality? Must they believe as you, that it's wrong and not right?
Meta !Sober//iZs joined in and replied with this 7 years ago, 15 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^][v]#961,541
I was going to make a joke about how religion used to be polytheistic, then monotheistic, and the next step should be 0.5 gods then I remembered it does exist and it's called deism.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 9 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^][v]#961,542
Deism is cool except what about the community though? What can deism do for the community?
Anonymous B replied with this 7 years ago, 1 hour later, 3 hours after the original post[^][v]#961,548
@961,537 (A)
The problem of defining right and wrong is a pretty thorny issue, but I think we can benefit from discussing it whenever people feel that it needs to be addressed. Rules about the right way to behave are as old as social groupings - whether it's a family, a tribe, a nation, or many nations having that discussion. These ideas arise naturally. I don't see what spirituality or a deity concept adds to that conversation.
What I see as wrong with figuring it out through religion or spirituality is that you can't figure it out that way. Religious inspiration or vague feelings of spirituality aren't a solid foundation on which to judge reality. I would rather deal with the world in front of me than to try to interpret it through vague feelings. I don't think you can divorce the concept of religion from old ideas and dogma without moving the definition so far that it becomes unrecognizable as religion. Even assuming you could, you would be relying on whatever religious feeling came to you in order to make ethical choices that you should be making by considering actual things happening in the actual world around you. I think letting inspiration and feelings guide your choices is certainly the wrong way to go about it when you have the luxury of reasoning about it.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 28 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^][v]#961,552
I think i can understand and by all means it's true in many cases. I think it's not always true though, I think that sometimes we should not be rational, because it would be so incredibly boring. We should let feelings and inspiration do its things sometimes.
Anonymous B replied with this 7 years ago, 19 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^][v]#961,555
@previous (A)
Yes, of course. Feeling and inspiration can a powerful driving force that lifts people up to do great things. I'm not saying we should live without it. I just don't think it's a good decision making tool by itself.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 7 years ago, 16 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^][v]#961,557
Let's suppose we were talking about actual tools, even though I know hardly anything about them. A hammer is a tool that could be terrible as a replacement for almost all other tools, but when it gets to nail nails? It's a wonderful tool for that. It's too black and white type of judgment.