Topic: the future of the democratic party and the impact of this election
Jubilee Starshine started this discussion 10 years ago #56,882
democrats have lost control of anything above the municipal level of government. the house, the senate, the presidency, and soon even the supreme court will lean to the right. where does that leave democrats, and what mechanisms are left for liberals to influence... anything?
there's the "liberal media" that will scrutinize every move washington makes, but they're so freaking discredited right now every major news source is legit neutered. there was fuck loads of propaganda on both sides, but it turns out largely the democratic propaganda machine worked a little too well and caught it's own party in a web of self delusion. even if the media does put trump under a microscope, no one will believe what they're being told they see. trump really could murder someone on 5th avenue and get away with it - as long as the new york times reports it first. the train is careening down the tracks, and now the people who're supposed to be insuring the integrity of the rails won't be trusted by the people running the locomotive.
i think that leaves the filibuster as the only real political mechanism the left can use to leverage anything. and that's got limited scope. i've also been hearing for a decade that congress could kill the filibuster if the opportunity arose, but that it's a double edged sword that would yield benefits only in the short term and could be damaging in the long. it's possible, if not probable, that in the short term the republicans may kill the filibuster to remove the last vestige of opposition in order to railroad in as much policy as they can write in the shortest time possible.
i'm struggling to think of anything else, i mean protests, but c'mon. anything real. i'm struggling to think of anything that elected democrats can do except watch the new republican renaissance happen. any criticism, valid or otherwise will be dismissed, and any attempt to block it can just be yanked away like a child with a teddy bear.
are we really just that fucked? do we really just have to sit back and take it?
i think we're about to get pussy grabbed... and i think we're just going to have to smile... and put it behind us.
there's the "liberal media" that will scrutinize every move washington makes, but they're so freaking discredited right now every major news source is legit neutered. there was fuck loads of propaganda on both sides, but it turns out largely the democratic propaganda machine worked a little too well and caught it's own party in a web of self delusion. even if the media does put trump under a microscope, no one will believe what they're being told they see. trump really could murder someone on 5th avenue and get away with it - as long as the new york times reports it first. the train is careening down the tracks, and now the people who're supposed to be insuring the integrity of the rails won't be trusted by the people running the locomotive.
i think that leaves the filibuster as the only real political mechanism the left can use to leverage anything. and that's got limited scope. i've also been hearing for a decade that congress could kill the filibuster if the opportunity arose, but that it's a double edged sword that would yield benefits only in the short term and could be damaging in the long. it's possible, if not probable, that in the short term the republicans may kill the filibuster to remove the last vestige of opposition in order to railroad in as much policy as they can write in the shortest time possible.
i'm struggling to think of anything else, i mean protests, but c'mon. anything real. i'm struggling to think of anything that elected democrats can do except watch the new republican renaissance happen. any criticism, valid or otherwise will be dismissed, and any attempt to block it can just be yanked away like a child with a teddy bear.
are we really just that fucked? do we really just have to sit back and take it?
i think we're about to get pussy grabbed... and i think we're just going to have to smile... and put it behind us.
Anonymous B joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 1 minute later[^] [v] #732,321
Demoncrats were just grabbed by the pussy and chucked over a wall. USAUSAUSA!
dawgg joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 2 minutes later, 3 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #732,324
chili dog !!81dzJNNYL joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 6 minutes later, 9 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #732,327
reading my facebook feed everyone is posting about this and it's getting me so anxious damn
Killer Lettuce? !!iNo3FkiZx joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 3 minutes later, 12 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #732,330
Yeah, it's gonna be a rough few years. Probably no foreseeable way around that.
But hey. It's a sure-fire thing that, in four years, the Dems get another shot to turn things around. This won't be forever.
But hey. It's a sure-fire thing that, in four years, the Dems get another shot to turn things around. This won't be forever.
dawgg replied with this 10 years ago, 2 minutes later, 14 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #732,331
@previous (Killer Lettuce? !!iNo3FkiZx)> Yeah, it's gonna be a rough few years. Probably no foreseeable way around that.
>
> But hey. It's a sure-fire thing that, in four years, the Dems get another shot to turn things around. This won't be forever.
YOU RETARDS SEEM TO FORGET THESE BOOKS
Jubilee Starshine (OP) replied with this 10 years ago, 39 minutes later, 54 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #732,342
@732,330 (Killer Lettuce? !!iNo3FkiZx)
yeah. you're right, of course. and i'm sure my fears are unfounded. (someone from north carolina just called my phone and i answered it and yelled, "fuck north carolina" and hung up, because fuck those hillbillies.) and i know it's the hip thing to do and people hate it because it's played out to even talk about hitler, but i'm going to anyway. because hitler didn't start out as a dictator, he started out as a demagogue riding a populist wave to victory. i mean, dude, trump didn't win. he didn't even think he was going to win, in the weeks and days and hours before there was almost confidence in his doubt. this was an upset of epic proportions. what won was the wave of populism that he gave a voice to. it could've been anyone as long as the message was on point. but, trump IS an authoritarian. under any normal situation i wouldn't feel a sense of foreboding, but i'm afraid his defeat of both parties is going to allow him to rebuild not only the republican party in his image, but the entire nation.
i really hope i'm wrong. i hope he brings us all the prosperity he promises. i hope they're not just the empty words of a narcissistic demagogue. but like i expressed to my trump voting co-workers, the arguing is over. there's no opposition left. there is nothing from stopping them from not just talking about replacing obamacare with something better, they can now just do it. repeal it, replace it, it's up to them. civil rights? abortion? voting rights? immigration? the economy? make america great again! there's no one to stop you, but no one to take the blame for you either. it's time to shut up, and put up. cause all the opposition can do is watch.
i for some reason have a very bad feeling that there will eventually be something that they do not want to own. you know? like already people are blaming trump's win on hillary, "she should've known how unelectable she was, it's her fault he won." not the million of people who voted for him. i mean even at work people that voted for him were still shocked. it was a protest vote for them. they thought he was going to lose too. they didn't believe in their heart of hearts that he'd win even WITH their vote. everyone was saying he was going to lose... i just have a bad feeling that years from now people will say, "oh, I didn't for FOR trump to win..." or some such nonsense because they don't want to take responsibility for what's about to happen.
yeah. you're right, of course. and i'm sure my fears are unfounded. (someone from north carolina just called my phone and i answered it and yelled, "fuck north carolina" and hung up, because fuck those hillbillies.) and i know it's the hip thing to do and people hate it because it's played out to even talk about hitler, but i'm going to anyway. because hitler didn't start out as a dictator, he started out as a demagogue riding a populist wave to victory. i mean, dude, trump didn't win. he didn't even think he was going to win, in the weeks and days and hours before there was almost confidence in his doubt. this was an upset of epic proportions. what won was the wave of populism that he gave a voice to. it could've been anyone as long as the message was on point. but, trump IS an authoritarian. under any normal situation i wouldn't feel a sense of foreboding, but i'm afraid his defeat of both parties is going to allow him to rebuild not only the republican party in his image, but the entire nation.
i really hope i'm wrong. i hope he brings us all the prosperity he promises. i hope they're not just the empty words of a narcissistic demagogue. but like i expressed to my trump voting co-workers, the arguing is over. there's no opposition left. there is nothing from stopping them from not just talking about replacing obamacare with something better, they can now just do it. repeal it, replace it, it's up to them. civil rights? abortion? voting rights? immigration? the economy? make america great again! there's no one to stop you, but no one to take the blame for you either. it's time to shut up, and put up. cause all the opposition can do is watch.
i for some reason have a very bad feeling that there will eventually be something that they do not want to own. you know? like already people are blaming trump's win on hillary, "she should've known how unelectable she was, it's her fault he won." not the million of people who voted for him. i mean even at work people that voted for him were still shocked. it was a protest vote for them. they thought he was going to lose too. they didn't believe in their heart of hearts that he'd win even WITH their vote. everyone was saying he was going to lose... i just have a bad feeling that years from now people will say, "oh, I didn't for FOR trump to win..." or some such nonsense because they don't want to take responsibility for what's about to happen.
(Edited 8 minutes later.)
Jubilee Starshine (OP) double-posted this 10 years ago, 13 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #732,344
but like i said, i hope i'm wrong. i hope it's all rainbows and sunshine and great and prosperous trade deals and diplomatic relations. but i just can't shake this feeling that that's delusional.
Anonymous F joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 8 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #732,346
When does the killing start?
Killer Lettuce? !!iNo3FkiZx replied with this 10 years ago, 10 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #732,362
@732,342 (Jubilee Starshine)
I empathise with you a lot. A similar wave of anti-establishment, populist rhetoric plunged my country towards a foreboding future. Disaffected working class puts populist politician(s) at the helm, said populists have a risk of fucking it all up.
Eh. I tried typing out some insightful political speculation for this paragraph, but all I really want to say at the moment is I hope that this surge of right-wing populism can be pushed back. Before it does too much damage.
I empathise with you a lot. A similar wave of anti-establishment, populist rhetoric plunged my country towards a foreboding future. Disaffected working class puts populist politician(s) at the helm, said populists have a risk of fucking it all up.
Eh. I tried typing out some insightful political speculation for this paragraph, but all I really want to say at the moment is I hope that this surge of right-wing populism can be pushed back. Before it does too much damage.
(Edited 1 minute later.)
Emil !r1rpNPeqN6 joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 2 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #732,365
Metæ joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 28 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #732,380
@OP
First, don't panic! The loser now will be later to win. Back in 2004 Karl Rove was predicting a permanent Republican majority and, well, you know what happened to that.
> there's the "liberal media" that will scrutinize every move washington makes, but they're so freaking discredited right now every major news source is legit neutered. there was fuck loads of propaganda on both sides, but it turns out largely the democratic propaganda machine worked a little too well and caught it's own party in a web of self delusion.
I don't think the media as whole has been neutered. FiveThirtyEight has taken one hell of a beating though and it will take a few election cycles to recover. I do think the media was overconfident in Clinton which caused complacency in some of her supporters, and a panicked frenzy in Trump supporters.
The worst problem (imo) is that people were excited about Trump. Maybe for deplorable reasons but Trump got people EXCITED. Excited FOR TRUMP, not just against Hillary. Hillary did not. Hillary support was 99% either anti-Trump or "lesser of two evils". Hillary's campaign felt scripted and forced and too safe.
> it's played out to even talk about hitler, but i'm going to anyway. because hitler didn't start out as a dictator, he started out as a demagogue riding a populist wave to victory.
I do worry that comparing people to Hitler is diminishing the importance to the point where if another Hitler does come, no one will listen or care.
First, don't panic! The loser now will be later to win. Back in 2004 Karl Rove was predicting a permanent Republican majority and, well, you know what happened to that.
> there's the "liberal media" that will scrutinize every move washington makes, but they're so freaking discredited right now every major news source is legit neutered. there was fuck loads of propaganda on both sides, but it turns out largely the democratic propaganda machine worked a little too well and caught it's own party in a web of self delusion.
I don't think the media as whole has been neutered. FiveThirtyEight has taken one hell of a beating though and it will take a few election cycles to recover. I do think the media was overconfident in Clinton which caused complacency in some of her supporters, and a panicked frenzy in Trump supporters.
The worst problem (imo) is that people were excited about Trump. Maybe for deplorable reasons but Trump got people EXCITED. Excited FOR TRUMP, not just against Hillary. Hillary did not. Hillary support was 99% either anti-Trump or "lesser of two evils". Hillary's campaign felt scripted and forced and too safe.
> it's played out to even talk about hitler, but i'm going to anyway. because hitler didn't start out as a dictator, he started out as a demagogue riding a populist wave to victory.
I do worry that comparing people to Hitler is diminishing the importance to the point where if another Hitler does come, no one will listen or care.
Sheila LaBoof joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 51 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #732,404
you don't know another hitler has come until it's already too late though
he was perceived as nothing much within his country at first too, then pulled some fast ones
@732,362 (Killer Lettuce? !!iNo3FkiZx)
typically that party manipulates populist sentiment to get elected, then continues to serve the monied elite as usual.
this time, the monied elite got spooked that Trump might be for real. it would actually be better if he is for real, and do some fighting in that shit party of his. worst case is that he's just another con, and it's monied elite in charge as usual. But really, the guy is monied elite, so there's irony out the ass all over here if in serving himself as #1 that he manages to dislodge some of the established monied elite control in the process. In any case, the quotes from supporters sound pretty retarded as they describe him as being against everything that he embodies in his business life which is delusional or something.
he was perceived as nothing much within his country at first too, then pulled some fast ones
@732,362 (Killer Lettuce? !!iNo3FkiZx)
typically that party manipulates populist sentiment to get elected, then continues to serve the monied elite as usual.
this time, the monied elite got spooked that Trump might be for real. it would actually be better if he is for real, and do some fighting in that shit party of his. worst case is that he's just another con, and it's monied elite in charge as usual. But really, the guy is monied elite, so there's irony out the ass all over here if in serving himself as #1 that he manages to dislodge some of the established monied elite control in the process. In any case, the quotes from supporters sound pretty retarded as they describe him as being against everything that he embodies in his business life which is delusional or something.
(Edited 6 minutes later.)
hoxha's dick !!4dPG8RpwY joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 3 hours later, 6 hours after the original post[^] [v] #732,467
Liberalism is dead. Replace Amerikkka with bunkers
Catherine !TGirlYJKXM replied with this 10 years ago, 11 hours later, 17 hours after the original post[^] [v] #732,568
A women will be elected after Trump. The Simpsons foreseen this.
beckyderp !Hi.HILLARY joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 3 minutes later, 17 hours after the original post[^] [v] #732,569
Killer Lettuce? !!iNo3FkiZx replied with this 10 years ago, 4 minutes later, 17 hours after the original post[^] [v] #732,570
Metæ replied with this 10 years ago, 7 minutes later, 18 hours after the original post[^] [v] #732,572
batuo joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 1 hour later, 20 hours after the original post[^] [v] #732,606
dw joined in and replied with this 10 years ago, 2 minutes later, 20 hours after the original post[^] [v] #732,608
DasSheeple replied with this 10 years ago, 22 minutes later, 20 hours after the original post[^] [v] #732,622
I am a liberal/left guy... But I can admit that women aren't suited to politics. It's too tough for them.