Anonymous B joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 9 minutes later[^][v]#88,588
Good. What a waste of money that was. And we still have absolutely nothing to support people's fantasies of alien civilisations being "out there".
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 15 years ago, 3 minutes later, 12 minutes after the original post[^][v]#88,589
@previous (B)
From the article: > the ATA is used for more than just alien searching; it’s been used to study all sources of intergalactic radio wave sources, for example and has been used to help with the study of black holes and other unexplained phenomena.
It's very little money, considering what it is. If we ever do find aliens, that would be the biggest event in human history.
Alien life is bound to exist, it's ridiculous to think in a universe this big only we exist. They recently found a lot of planets that could have life as well.
I don't think this will last, and it looks like they can rent out their telescopes to other people to raise some money (the Air Force was interesting according to this article).
Anonymous B replied with this 15 years ago, 20 minutes later, 32 minutes after the original post[^][v]#88,592
> Alien life is bound to exist, it's ridiculous to think in a universe this big only we exist. They recently found a lot of planets that could have life as well.
I think if people want to believe that there is alien life out there, that's fine, but I don't think they should go around pretending their theory deserves to have tax dollars wasted on it, much less that it has any scientific credibility. Science goes by evidence, and at the moment there's absolutely zero evidence that alien life exists.
(Edited 1 minute later.)
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 15 years ago, 13 minutes later, 46 minutes after the original post[^][v]#88,596
> much less that it has any scientific credibility. Science goes by evidence, and at the moment there's absolutely zero evidence that alien life exists.
That's just not true. Have you even heard of The Drake Equation?
Syntax joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 22 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#88,598
Some have called me an Alien ....SETI is not shut down, just one segment which is very important. Before that array was even thought of there were all kinds of arrays all over planet earth. I know of many small set ups doing work for SETI. Anyone with a back yard can. I have a few 6 Meter dishes scattered around Planet Earth and until now have never considered offering them up to SETI...Would cost no one a dime and they can all be run by remote control but of course are limited to a window in the C S and L bands ...still very useful ...This is the kind of thing Amateurs are good at.
Anonymous B replied with this 15 years ago, 36 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#88,600
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 15 years ago, 1 hour later, 2 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,617
@previous (B)
Look, I get that it's probably hyped up a bunch, and there are not as many as he estimated. But with all of the life-capable planets in our galaxy that we know of, and the billions and billions of galaxies in existance, there is bound to be life somewhere else. It's possible SETI could go on for a century without finding this life, but the chance, however small, is motive enough.
As an added bonus it serves secondary goals, like I mentioned earlier. It may take a while to find other life, but at least in the meantime something good comes of it.
Anonymous D joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 9 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,619
@previous (A)
let people who wish to support seti donate their money to it. Do not take my money by coercion and the give it to such a useless project
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 15 years ago, 21 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,620
@previous (D)
Instead of getting into such a rage about a few cents added to your taxes, why not try to compell politicians to stop with the wars? Those are what really cost people money.
National "defense" wastes trillions of dollars, which means on an individual level you losing thousands of dollars at tax time.
You have a hundred thousand times more reasons to care about wars, why even bother with protesting SETI?
(Edited 19 seconds later.)
Killer Lettuce !!iNo3FkiZx joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 44 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,623
That's a real shame. They were such an interesting project.
Syntax replied with this 15 years ago, 1 hour later, 5 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,631
SETI offers other advantages besides just looking for intelligence in space. (Considering that not much Intelligence is here on Earth)
Engineering advances that NASA is using as results and design for front ends of receivers for microwaves that defense dept has interest in and Phased array antennas that have intelligence agency interests. When one looks at the Science that alone may be the real return in investment.
#88,619
Hummmmmmm Good thing you were not around when Cris Columbo needed a few bucks to sail some ships long ago.
Anonymous F joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 1 hour later, 7 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,650
> But with all of the life-capable planets in our galaxy that we know of, and the billions and billions of galaxies in existance, there is bound to be life somewhere else.
Maybe that's your belief, but until you can support it with some form of empirical evidence, it's a faith-based belief, not a scientific one. Don't be surprised, then, when people don't want to waste money on it.
Nickalollyoff !Aw0s40dyqw joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 2 hours later, 9 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,679
HERE'S THE PROBLEM WITH SETI
IT REQUIRES BEINGS FROM OTHER WORLDS USING THE PRECISE TECHNOLOGY WE ARE AT THE PRECISE TIME TO PICK IT UP SENT TO THE PRECISE AREA AND THE PRECISE FREQUENCY
AND IF ALIENS ARE USING FM RADIO SIGNALS TO COMMUNICATE WITH US IT'S PRETTY CERTAIN THEY DON'T HAVE SPACESHIPS
JUST FORD MONDEOS
I MEAN JESUS FUCK
brie !OudrPWaUDQ joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 3 hours later, 13 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,732
@previous (Nickalollyoff !Aw0s40dyqw)
That's not the problem.
Assuming that most of the universe follows the same physical laws as out region of space does, it is likely that an intelligent, technologically advanced lifeform will have utilized the electromagnetic spectrum for communication at some point during their advancement.
The theory goes that there are "shells" of radio waves emanating from planets where intelligent life arose, perhaps hundreds of years "thick". Yeah, as the level of technology improves so does the efficiency of communication methods until it is all but undectable, but hey, the search is just a giant crapshoot anyway so why the fuck not have a look?
Also, of course we are searching for life that is like us in some way.
The whole "utilizing radio frequencies" thing would be something in common to chat about over coffee.
(Edited 7 minutes later.)
Anonymous I joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 10 minutes later, 13 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,738
The Minichan folding@home team has been active for a long time. Currently, myself, DM and an anon are the only active participants but I invite the rest of you to join.
Our team ID number is 196173
(Edited 4 minutes later.)
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 15 years ago, 32 minutes later, 13 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,753
@previous (I)
Wow! I was just thinking about suggesting we make one!
Anonymous A (OP) double-posted this 15 years ago, 4 minutes later, 13 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,759
@88,650 (F)
Just because something has not been absolutely proven does not make it "faith based". SOme ideas are more probable than others, and this is one of them. It's a fact that other planets could support life, and there are many of them. It's not unlikely that many contain life.
It is more improbable that only we contain life.
Syntax replied with this 15 years ago, 3 hours later, 17 hours after the original post[^][v]#88,900
@previous (A)
Fun stuff in thread wood luv to contribute but that silly wedding in England has me so fucking tied up!!!! Ok not silly re it helps economy of England and all the colonies as well as USA spending lots of $$$$ to cover and ad revenue n such and puts much in my pocket to go to Harvard Med
Will contribute when tyme
Anonymous B replied with this 15 years ago, 4 hours later, 21 hours after the original post[^][v]#89,078
k, I guess that one does come across as a bit petty.
All I'm trying to say that we don't have any rationally/scientifically sound reason to believe that alien life exists, or even that there's any probability that alien life exists. At the moment it's all faith and conjecture.
Broseph !!fxnDb+Ve4 replied with this 15 years ago, 1 hour later, 23 hours after the original post[^][v]#89,195
@previous (B)
I still wouldn't call it faith. We don't have much to go on to come up with a probability, but that doesn't mean there is no probability. Just because it's all conjecture doesn't mean it's unscientific or faith based. We have enough scientific knowledge about how life on this planet developed and evolved, and what qualities about earth allow it to sustain life, and it's reasonable to believe that if it could happen on earth, it could happen on one of the other trillions of solar systems out there. Whether or not we will actually find, or if it will be reasonably close to us, or if any of the life will be intelligent, I agree is highly unlikely. But it's not faith based to say that it's plausible and that we should explore the idea.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 15 years ago, 4 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,339
Anonymous K joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 2 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,381
@88,620 (A)
lol my post was entirely reasonable while yours was completely butthurt
say what you want about the wars (I think they are indefensible morally and economically) but they have actual results, unlike seti.
I protest all evils concurrently. Your position is that we should not take action on gay rights and drug legalization until we stop the wars. Why not pursue all simultaneously?
Anonymous K double-posted this 15 years ago, 4 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,384
@88,631 (Syntax)
I would have given it to a more competent navigator. Columbus was a (lucky) fool who had made massive errors while calculating his route to India. Either way, the government was investing in Columbus. He was to bring them back gold and they would have a monopoly on the trade route. Will seti be reimbursing the american people? Will seti grant the US government a monopoly on trade with aliens? It will not, and is an unjustifiable breach of liberty.
Anonymous K triple-posted this 15 years ago, 3 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,386
How this for unscientific, faith-based conjecture? Millions of people around the world are starving, while the government takes our money and uses it to send messages into the emptiness of space.
This is sick and wrong.
wtf? replied with this 15 years ago, 5 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,552
@previous (K)
Again good you were not alive when Christopher Columbus was alive and needed money to sail.
Lynne B Goldstein replied with this 15 years ago, 5 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,554
@previous (wtf?) > I would have given it to a more competent navigator. Columbus was a (lucky) fool who had made massive errors while calculating his route to India. Either way, the government was investing in Columbus. He was to bring them back gold and they would have a monopoly on the trade route. Will seti be reimbursing the american people? Will seti grant the US government a monopoly on trade with aliens? It will not, and is an unjustifiable breach of liberty.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 15 years ago, 1 hour later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,581
> I protest all evils concurrently. Your position is that we should not take action on gay rights and drug legalization until we stop the wars. Why not pursue all simultaneously?
I never said anything like that.
I said SETI was of neglibible cost next to the Wars.
Marijuana legalization would save us a lot of money. Gay rights is about equality, it's not about saving a small bit of money.
Anonymous A (OP) double-posted this 15 years ago, 1 minute later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,585
@89,386 (K)
Per year it costs less than one attack helicopter.
The cost of this project is minimal. Wars cost you hundreds of thousands more than this ever would.
Lynne B Goldstein replied with this 15 years ago, 6 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,795
That is entirely irrelevant. Stop deflecting. This program is a waste of taxpayers money. If you like seti, you should donate to it. Don't force me to give to it.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 15 years ago, 41 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,843
> You did say that, but because you do not understand logic (hence why you so ardently support a failed project) you do not realize it.
Oh, okay. > If there was someone stealing $1 a day from the government I don't think we should wait til we stop the wars before we prosecute him.
Like many politicians, you focus on small non-issues and ignore the big ones. > > That is entirely irrelevant.
The price of something is completely relevant when talking about whether or not it should be paid for. > Stop deflecting. This program is a waste of taxpayers money. If you like seti, you should donate to it. Don't force me to give to it.
No government project will ever have 100% support. Perhaps we should just shut down the whole government then?
I'm forced to give to wars, supporters of that can donate if they like, I simply suggest taking a bit of that money and putting it into science, health, and other projects (like SETI). The rest doesn't need to be taken in the first place (lower taxes).
(Edited 1 minute later.)
Lynne B Goldstein replied with this 15 years ago, 11 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,853
> Like many politicians, you focus on small non-issues and ignore the big ones.
One can focus on many things at once. You are lying here, as I have already voiced my distaste for the imperial wars and the war on drugs.
> The price of something is completely relevant when talking about whether or not it should be paid for.
You are 100% wrong here. If the government SHOULD be paying for something it matters not how expensive, they will have to raise taxes etc to meet it.
If the government SHOULDN'T be paying for something it matters not how cheap it is, it still immoral and wrong.
> No government project will ever have 100% support. Perhaps we should just shut down the whole government then?
When did I ever say that 100% support was necessary for a government project? #strawman
> I'm forced to give to wars, supporters of that can donate if they like, I simply suggest taking a bit of that money and putting it into science, health, and other projects (like SETI). The rest doesn't need to be taken in the first place (lower taxes).
Defence of the nation is one of the duties of government. Science, health and other projects are not. I believe the current government is doing a bad job at defense, not that the government has no right to defend the nation. The government should not be investing in science, health and other projects.
Anonymous A (OP) replied with this 15 years ago, 3 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#89,945
@previous (Lynne B Goldstein)
Yes, yes. Your political views are absolutely right and everyone else is wrong.
This isn't a discussion, this is you making statements.
There is not an objective list of the things government ought to, and ought not to do. People will disagree on what those things are then, please understand this.
Acting as if your half-baked libertarian-esque ideals deserve to be accepted just 'cause is ridiculous.
Lynne B Goldstein replied with this 15 years ago, 9 hours later, 2 days after the original post[^][v]#90,174
> Yes, yes. Your political views are absolutely right and everyone else is wrong.
Stop deflecting. This was a basic question of logic. End your fallacious arguments.
> This isn't a discussion, this is you making statements.
That is what happens in a discussion. If one makes an incorrect statement the other corrects them. You are unable to do so, yet do not want to change your opinion. Intellectual weakness.
> There is not an objective list of the things government ought to, and ought not to do. People will disagree on what those things are then, please understand this.
LOL It's called THE CONSTITUTION.
> Acting as if your half-baked libertarian-esque ideals deserve to be accepted just 'cause is ridiculous.
You insult my ideals without giving a reason why. If anyone is appealing to "Just cause!" it is you.
RogiPhone !tiQBrOS.jo joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 2 hours later, 2 days after the original post[^][v]#90,224
Life is a pretty unique structure to earth, assuming it started on earth. Sure there may be something similar out there, but I doubt it's life as we think of it. Just my thoughts on that.
EDIT: Ah, this is a SETI thread. That's interesting that they cut part of the projct lol