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Catherine !TGirlYJKXM started this discussion 12 years ago#34,092
I think it might be time for me to spread my wings and fly. By this I mean look for my own place, but I have no experience in finding apartments or what to look for.
Doesn't anyone know any pointers you can give me?
I know someone will probably recommend Craigslist in this thread though.
dw ltd joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 4 minutes later[^][v]#470,702
craigslist
decibelmilliwatts !!beW+FQoWB joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 3 minutes later, 8 minutes after the original post[^][v]#470,704
Craigslist
squeegee !first/o5zA joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 57 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#470,709
if the apartment doesn't pay utilities, you can request a copy of the utility bills for the apartment you like, that way you can factor in the cost of utilities. Also, read the lease. Annotate it if you like. If something doesn't apply to you, make them cross it out and both of you initial the change (e.g. common area maintenance, if you get told you don't contribute to that, make them put it in writing or you'll get bum fucked.) If they freak out that you annotate the lease, don't rent the apartment, they are trying to screw you. Just make sure everything they say is documented, initialed and signed. If the landlord tries to get you to sign a lease without going through it line-by-line, making the appropriate changes, they are trying to screw you.
if your move in date is, like, the 15th or the 20th, don't let them charge you a full months rent, make them prorate it. If they don't, don't lease with them.
When you fill out the form indicating damages present when you move it, document everything from the smallest scuff on the wood to scratches on the walls, spots on the carpet. if you don't do this, they will rape your security deposit.
submit all maintenance request in writing, do not count on a verbal agreement to accomplish anything. document document document, and keep a copy for your records. if you don't have a copy of a maintenance request, then potentially they can claim you neglected to notify them of repairs and sue you for damages. (eg water damage if left unreported, or claimed to be unreported, could cost you a ton of trouble.)
don't lease with a place that has a ton of external amenities (like a community pool, or gym) if you don't plan to use it regularly. Part of the cost of rent goes towards maintaining common areas, don't pay for what you won't use.
start small, start cheap. if your new apartment costs more than one weeks pay, then it may be unaffordable when you start factoring in food, clothes, utilities, entertainment and all that stuff you like to do. If you don't know what it costs to feed you for a week, simply document your meals for 7 days, go shopping and price out a weeks food, then average that over the month. that plus old utility bills will show you the approximate cost of living on your own for a month (sans entertainment and whatever) and your leftover pay is what you'll have to spend on everything else.
if i think of anything else i'll add it
edit: renters insurance is pretty cheap, like 12 bucks a month or something. Worth it if you have anything you'd be hard pressed to replace (like if all your furniture is hand me downs you might not be able to replace it all if there's a burst hot water heater and everything mildews.)
(Edited 3 minutes later.)
Rogi FORGOT HIS DAMN TRIPCODE joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 2 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#470,710
I wouldn't even call it hunting, it's cruel and unfair. The poor things can't run off or defend themselves.
Killer Lettuce !!iNo3FkiZx joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 5 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#470,712
@470,709 (squeegee !first/o5zA)
That is actually really helpful. I shall keep this post in mind. Thanks, squeegee.
squeegee !first/o5zA replied with this 12 years ago, 11 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#470,715
@previous (Killer Lettuce !!iNo3FkiZx)
sure thing, the best trick i know is withholding rent. you'd have to check your local renter's rights laws and all, but in some situations you can withhold rent in order to force the management to comply. for example in texas between fall and winter (certain days) you can withhold rent if they refuse to repair your heating or gas. In the summer you can withhold for air conditioning maintenance. it's kind of a dangerous move that can backfire if you don't follow the "rules", but in my experience when dealing with "slum lords" or just really shitty management the only thing that motivates them is money.
i had to do this a few times to get work orders written to fix unsecured entry and heat. very potent trick, but also nothing pisses off the landlords more than being forced to comply to renters demands. fuck you is the mentality i've often had to deal with. When apartments have no vacancies then it's either your rent or some other schmucks. you don't matter, just your rent.
Catherine !TGirlYJKXM (OP) replied with this 12 years ago, 22 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^][v]#470,720
This has been a very informative thread.
Thank you, squeegee.
Anonymous G joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 36 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,722
Craigslist. I'm moving out into my own place on Friday. Craigslist didn't help, though. It almost did.
squeegee !first/o5zA replied with this 12 years ago, 12 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,726
@470,720 (Catherine !TGirlYJKXM)
sure thing. It's really all very easy. Your biggest problem will be lack of renters history. Some places won't lease without some kind of proof you are reliable or a guarantee that you'll pay. it's been a while but i think you can have your parents co-sign, just to ensure that they'll get their money.
If you can't get co signers (or if i'm wrong and that's not a thing (i think it is though)) then you can look for rooms to rent and do that for 6 months and try again for an apartment with a referral as a good tenant.
there are also tons of places that will do 6 month leases or let you go month-to-month. You pay first and last months rent up front, so it's a big initial expense, and also the rent is typically higher when on short leases or month to month. But if they really don't trust you with a full lease as a new renter, possibly they'll let you build up history month to month.
once in an apartment your first year will dictate how you look to future land lords. Be sure to pay on time, every month, and don't be a nuisance. After you build up a year of good history you can move to a more desirable apartment if your first one is lame.
speaking of lame, your first apartment will be lame. it will be small, it will be a box, it will smell "funny" to you, and it will be old. You'll get used to the smell, the size will be cozy, it will still be an unadorned box with gypsum walls and it will be old, but it'll be your for only a year. it won't be the last place you live, so don't approach it like you need everything you've ever wanted.
but don't think i'm telling you to live in a slum, you've got no pressing need to move today, so shop around and really do your homework and find a place that's a good balance of cost and amenities. Also actively look for places that are bills paid. everything is rolled into your lease agreement and you pay one sum each month for everything. Those apartments might naturally be a little more expensive since things are rolled in, but the benefit is that you won't have big spikes in utilities, like summer months can be brutal. definitely take a note from your parents and turn off lights in rooms you aren't in and turn off the AC in the middle of august when you aren't home.
but, if you get a place that's bills paid it's all the same all the time.
the downside being in those cost savings months of spring and fall you don't see any savings from having virtually no utility payments, it's all just a flat payment. but the security in knowing august will cost you no more than april can be pretty reassuring.
Anonymous H joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 14 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,727
@OP
Buy yourself a few things before you move out, while you are looking for a place. Basic stuff for the kitchen and bathroom etc, if you don't already have it.
Ash !bbKEtchUp. joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 12 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,729
op get a furnished apartment it costs more in the long run but will be more affordable if youre broke
squeegee !first/o5zA replied with this 12 years ago, 21 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,731
@previous (Ash !bbKEtchUp.)
furnished apartments around here tend to be pretty pricey. i say blah on that unless it's like a real good deal. i'm sure they're out there, but goodwill and hand me downs and garage sales will fill Cat's place up rather quickly.
@OP
you probably have a bed and a desk, maybe a floor rug, plus whatever stuff you've already got. But you'll probably need a couch or a couple of chairs, maybe a table. look for family hand-me-downs, or check garage sales and goodwill (awesome starter stuff, really.) the kitchen can be expensive, either beg your parents for pots and pans, or buy them at good will or a garage sale. Every body has old pots and pans and you can get them practically for free. Same with silverware and plates, but those are also pretty cheap at walmart.
buy a shower curtain from the store, buy floor mats, and steal your favorite towels from your folks (they can buy new towels.)
you'll want a small set of basic tools, a couple of screw drivers, a small hammer, pliers, needle nosed pliers, roll of electrical tape, a roll of duct tape, a tube of super glue (with or without accelerator) couple of spare light bulbs, pocket knife or box cutter, small flashlight, few AA batteries. you can pick most of this up at the dollar store, by the way. you won't need anything fancy like wrenches or drills or anything electrical - if you have a problem that calls for that stuff you have an issue for maintenance. Also think about hardware, like a hand full of nails, a few screws (2" - 3" drywall screws will fill any screw need you have), maybe a few "bulldog" dry wall anchors (for heavy stuff up to 50lbs like shelves that hold weight, or heavier wall hanging items) or molly bolts, some picture frame hangers (the cheap little brass ones), and that'll probably cover most anything you'll ever need to do in an apartment.
Edit: oh yeah, also cleaners. Get a good all purpose cleaner for most everything, and get something with bleach in it or a good disinfectant to clean the bathroom with. A nice shower curtain won't mildew so much, but your shower tiles will. Mildew-away type shit works, just get it at the dollar store. you'll also want a toilet brush and a maybe a plunger.
but really, and i mean for real, it's best to have maintenance unclog your toilet. improper use of a plunger can burst pipes. seriously. so consider a plunger to not be a necessity when apartment dwelling.
(Edited 7 minutes later.)
squeegee !first/o5zA double-posted this 12 years ago, 28 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,736
oh yeah, best advise ever. see, i've actually never bought dishes, pots and pans or silverware. not once.
but i've got a full kitchen a short order cook would be comfortable in. Everything was either a hand-me-down at first, or came to me as a christmas or birthday gift. Now, what i've found is that when you make the transition to adulthood, a remarkable thing happens. When you're a kid you ask for toys and you get them, but maybe you don't get the xbox 1, maybe you get the cheaper just xbox. what's the difference, right? adults don't know. they don't care! but adults know pots and pans, and bedding. they know the good stuff. And when you finally "grow up" and the first christmas you tell people, "oh, i don't want anything special, but i could use a new pot or pan or two, or maybe some new bath towels, idk, my cutlery isn't all it could be." And what happens that's remarkable is that adults get that, and when they buy for you you'll suddenly make out like a bandit with a brand new set of Wolf Gang Puck kitchenware, brand new full sized darned and fluffed whatever bath towels, and a linen robe, and 300 thread count egyptian cotton sheets, and Martha Stewart comforters and blankets, and new silverware, and 4 place settings with cups and glasses, a mr.coffee, all kinds of weird little appliances and spice racks and vegetable oil filled vials of spice impregnated cooking juices.
it's crazy really. when you ask for adult stuff for christmas, it's like asking for the most practical non-selfish stuff ever. just be appreciative of it all and you'll never need to buy anything for your kitchen or bathroom again. it really makes shopping for you fun and easy when you just say, "oh, practical stuff like a new trashcan for the kitchen and some new bedding." you'll get that plus so much more.
Why? I'm not sure, but i think it's because when you ask for practical stuff, (like tools) people don't feel like they've gotten you a real gift. Society has pressed into our minds that gifts should be somewhat impractical or extravagant, "get them something they'll never get themselves," they say. So if they can't get you anything extravagant, then they'll just spend impractically and overwhelm you with laundry baskets, decorative soaps, throw pillows and picture frames.
just watch their reaction when on your birthday you ask for a vacuum cleaner. they'll be like, "we'd better get cat an xbone too."
(Edited 1 minute later.)
Ash !bbKEtchUp. replied with this 12 years ago, 1 hour later, 5 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,765
@previous (squeegee !first/o5zA)
in my experience the tools i require to make food in is a fork, spoon, serrated knife, spatula, a tong, a small sauce pan, a large sauce pan and a frying pan... but i could probably make do without most of that and would prefer much more.. except i use a wallpaper scraper instead of a spatula because it is stronger and less prone to wear, i can also scrape burned in dirt off my equipment with it when i am cleaning
anyway im saying its easy to cook without all the fancy stuff if you need to cut down on initial expenses. i can make a pizza from scratch using nothing but a pint glass and a spoon and my hands. equipment wise at first i would just look for a fridge-freezer, an oven and a microwave.
also instead of buying those premade cleaning chemicals buy concentrated sanitiser and degreaser and some spray bottles for them. you can get 2l of both for $60 in the uk and it will last you a LOT longer than the brand bottled stuff, the degreaser makes cleaning your dirty oven/microwave/vents take 2 minutes and the sanitiser is basically a universal replacement for everything you use to clean
kook !!32zdfdzi+ joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 4 minutes later, 5 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,769
@470,736 (squeegee !first/o5zA)
My family hates buying practical gifts. I'll ask for pillows and ballpoint pens or something, and they'll act like I'm crazy.
Ash !bbKEtchUp. replied with this 12 years ago, 3 minutes later, 5 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,771
i like to buy gifts that are specific to the person i buy them for
my last gift was to my friend who likes hello kitty and smoking weed, so i got this guy on etsy to make a glass hello kitty pipe, and the one before that was to my friend who likes apple and pug dogs and starbucks, so i created a fake starbucks logo with a cartoon of him wearing a tshirt that he wore to gay pride and waving flags with an apple logo on one and a pug on the other
squeegee !first/o5zA replied with this 12 years ago, 21 minutes later, 6 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,774
@470,765 (Ash !bbKEtchUp.)
yeah, that's all good, and i forgot the microwave. By my experience you'll probably need one. fridge/oven/dish washer are usually provided. Also washer and dryer, you'll ether have a communal laundry room, a furnished washer and dryer, or no washer and dryer, no communal laundry but you have hook-ups to buy your own machines (don't do this). probably what's best is communal laundry rooms. cheapest anyways. plus you can meet neighbors. if you really want an apartment with washer and dryer furnished it's going to be pricier.
lofts and efficiencies (just small 1 room apartments, like 550sqr ft) usually have communal laundry, and are really the best priced apartments for starting off. you also need less "stuff" to make it appear lived in. It sucks living in a giant 2 bedroom apartment with only a tv and a chair. feels engulfing :( efficiencies can be nice and cozy.
oh yeah, don't do rent-to-own furniture or electronics stuff. not worth it. there's like rent-a-center or something in texas and if you were like a traveling employee and needed a place for 2 months then you might fill up an apartment with rent-to-own furniture, but you don't keep it. that's the kind of thing that puts people deep in credit card debt and really is pretty much a scam.
learn to save. Probably the best advise i got starting off was to have a savings account. it was silly, like 10 bucks from every pay check at first. I never touched it, eventually it got to be 190 minimum per paycheck as i advanced and earned more. suddenly all that weekly saving turned into quite a lot of money and, honestly, i had to invest it in a property because just saving it was losing me money!
so, learn to save, do it early, and learn how to save more as you earn more. and seriously, i know the temptation will be great, but don't tap into your savings to buy "possessions," and if you absolutely can't restrain yourself (it's hard when you hit 10 grand to not go out and buy a new car) just don't go overboard and know that what your working on is the seed to plant an investment. you're not saving up to spend it on junk.
if you want to buy something frivolous like a fur suit then get a coffee can and start saving up whatever is left after you've paid into your saving account. my "coffee can" (re: checking account) really never floats above a couple of thousand, everything else is paid out to creditors or dumped into a savings account which ultimately grows into some kind of investment or money market thing. i dunno, i got a guy. anyway, it all started with 10 bucks a week. a laughable venture, at the time.
Anonymous K joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 1 hour later, 7 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,805
My advice is, don't. Every dollar spent on rent is a dollar thrown down a rat hole. You need to get a mortgage, even if it's just on a tiny little condo or townhouse, because then you own it, so you haven't actually lost that money. It's in your equity. It's like all the money you would be putting towards rent is instead going into a savings account that you just happen to live in.
And if you don't have the money or the credit for a mortgage yet, you're not ready to spread your wings. Don't fall into the rent trap. My sister and her boyfriend were spending $1251/month on rent, when that money could have been going into a house. After wasting $30,000, they finally moved back in with my parents, and being off the rent treadmill they were able to save up for a down payment on a house in less than a year.
squeegee !first/o5zA replied with this 12 years ago, 1 hour later, 8 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,830
@previous (K)
great plan once you have the 20% down payment or more that you generally need to secure a mortgage. They accumulated a years worth of rent for two people, one person would take longer to save up. Sure, living with parents is a great way to save money and save up for a mortgage, but you also will need a co-signer unless you make good bank and have a history of paying off debts.
Also home ownership comes with quite a lot of expense. You'll need a new fence every 15 or so years, and last i checked it was around 10 grand for a 6 ft wooden post fence. plus you're responsible for all repairs, and things like roofs, foundations, and air conditioning can cost you tens of thousands of dollars to repair. Not only that but when you buy, and have a mortgage, you throw away every dollar spent on interest and that can be quite a lot. you'll spend as much on interest as you do on the house itself. you don't actually start building real equity until about half way through your mortgage. think of it like this, for the first 15 years of a 30 year note you'll mostly be paying on the interest and very little goes towards the principle, after about 15 years you actually start paying off the house instead of just the interest.
so don't buy a house unless you plan to stay living there for, like, for awhile. If you need to move frequently (which often times happens when you're under 30) a house is a huge waste of money. frequently being, like, once every 10 years.
get your credit going, build a good history of paying rent and paying debts on time, save your money, and when you're ready to settle down you'll have everything ready to go and you'll have a lot of experience dealing with the biggest problem to plague young first time home owners, how to budget so you won't risk losing your home when you get it.
(Edited 7 minutes later.)
squeegee !first/o5zA double-posted this 12 years ago, 5 minutes later, 8 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,832
having a house is like spending two dollars and getting back one.
renting is like spending a dollar and getting back none.
you still have to spend that dollar, and one is way, way easier to start with.
Condos though are kind of a mix, you'll throw away a fuck load of money on Home Owner's association dues, and that straight up doesn't go towards equity at all. it's like owning the inside and renting the building. kind of fucked, really, but still better than owning a single-family home when you only need 1 bedroom. the utilities alone...
Anonymous L joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 12 minutes later, 9 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,834
@OP
Squeegee's advice is all good, but sitting down with some apartment manager who wants to rent you a cheap apartment in a cheap part of town isn't going to go well when you start insisting that you want to line-edit the rental agreement. (It's fine advice! You should totally do this in an ideal world!) But given that you will likely be one in a long list of people looking to rent -and that you are likely a first-time renter- you might want to hold off on the contract negotiation tactics until you have a little more clout. Squeegee makes a lot of sense. (especially about documenting everything from what they tell you to the minor (you only think they're minor now, wait until they try to claim that they need $500 of your deposit to replace everything) dents in the cabinets) If you are looking for cheap apartment and not paying through the nose for a penthouse suite on the waterfront, you might have to make some concessions. Incidentally, do document everything. Do take time-stamped pictures (and save them) of every goddamn ding in the wall and scratch on the floor if you manage to find a place.
(Edited 37 seconds later.)
squeegee !first/o5zA replied with this 12 years ago, 16 minutes later, 9 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,841
mostly the line by line thing is something that a good apartment manager will do anyways, they go through it line by line, cross out what doesn't apply and have you both initial the change.
a sign of a bad complex and a bad manager is one that tries to get you to sign a lease quickly without making sure you actually read each paragraph. They should practically sit there and read it to you, line by line. if they don't want to do this, then just move along.
if you know what you're doing you can force the proper procedure and get everything done up legit, but as a first time renter you'll be looking for experienced people to kind of take you by the hand through the whole process. A good apartment manager will make sure you read the lease and lay everything out very clearly for you in writing.
if they don't, and you do not make sure they do, then beware. remember there is nothing wrong or confrontational about saying, "thank you, may i have that writing for my records." if they don't want to comply to that simple request, you might look elsewhere.
but yes, you'll have absolutely zero power initially, so just be prepared feel "swept up."
(Edited 1 minute later.)
squeegee !first/o5zA double-posted this 12 years ago, 13 minutes later, 9 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,843
just remember that the lease is just a written version of a verbal contract between you and the leasing agent. Whatever gets said had better be reflected on paper, otherwise whatever gets said doesn't matter. most states have a pretty standard lease contract and most places will use the defacto common forms, which may have things that don't apply, which is why reading and verifying and annotating the lease is part of the job of leasing apartments. Some places have their own personal lease agreement, usually they have to notify you before entering your premises with 24 hour notice, but i once lived in a place that just came and went whenever they liked. really, it was even signed into the lease that way. I initialed that shit! why? apparently to service the building they have to use access holes in the unit's closets to get up under the building, so they needed to sometimes come and go and disappear into the closet hole for a few hours. kinda funny actually, the first time it happened when i had a girl over. she was like... how many of them are down there?
anyways, leases can have some weird shit in them. always read them thoroughly
Anonymous L replied with this 12 years ago, 3 minutes later, 9 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,844
@470,841 (squeegee !first/o5zA)
Understand please, that your advice for renters (judging from my humble experience renting) has been top-fucking-notch in this thread. Everything you have said has been spot-on.
I just don't know if all renters will be able to do everything listed. In an ideal world, renters would have landlords competing for people to get their apartments, and the renters would be able to control the exchange. This probably won't happen. (Catherine is in California? I think... so this probably won't ever actually happen.) Be prepared to make some allowances, Cathy.
Otherwise, squeegee -nice!- you should write a goddamn book.
And, yeah - read (and scan/photocopy/ask for a photocopy) any agreement and be sure you have a copy you can refer back to before you agree to anything.
(Edited 2 minutes later.)
Anonymous H replied with this 12 years ago, 1 hour later, 11 hours after the original post[^][v]#470,856
@OP
Don't sweat it if you don't have everything squeegee says, it all comes with time and necessity. Buy a couple of towels, and a can opener etc. Life is tough, but it's your own and you'll figure it out. Remember to help others, because you'll need their help too.
Getting out there and doing it is far more important than being ready, because you'll never be totally ready so just go and do it.
squeegee !first/o5zA replied with this 12 years ago, 14 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#470,936
so i haven't given a ton of help on apartment hunting, more about apartment living.
for hunting i would suggest you narrow it down as much as possible at the very beginning. There's likely a website you can use to show you all the apartments available in your city. I would generally consider 3 factors when choosing a place, for this example we'll go with proximity to employment, accessibility to public transportation, and security.
so if those are your big 3, you'll want to look for a place that is either near to where you will be working, or, make sure that you are close to a densely populated area with lots of opportunity to find work. you'll want accessibility to public transit because if your vehicle becomes unreliable it can be a huge burden to be saddled with impending repairs. if you have access to public transport it can actually save your job if you're unable to drive. When i lived in austin their excellent bus system saved my ass constantly. (plus it's great for when drunk)
As far as security goes, just scope out the immediate neighborhoods. I don't know what it's like where you are, but in texas you can stand on Ross Perot's property and throw a rock and hit the ghetto. this is not actually true, he lives on Strait lane, but you could actually throw a rock from his property and hit just more of his property.it's perty big
here's a funny thing:
a post i found on some "area's to avoid in dallas" thing.
Ive lived in Dallas my whole life, more than 30 years. There are areas I don't even want to drive around by myself like around metropolitan ave./ I30 munger area, park ln and Greenville, Bryan street, Ross ave, Gaston, Garland rd/E grand ave., Samual blvd, any part of Dallas near mesquite, and sorry to say but south dallas/Oak Cliff. I lived in an apt off of skillman and audelia...what a mistake! That was frightening. I had to phone 911 2 times while I lived there (6 months) The funny thing is most of these areas have something I love there and I will go in a group during the day. Dallas is huge, much of it is nice and some of it is even beautiful. Some of the most gorgeous neighborhoods are surrounded by the getto. Its strange. Im a small attractive woman and never have I been accosted or assaulted. Ive had plenty beggers, that's it. Some of these reviews make it seem so scary, its not! Its a normal place, I ve been around! Its just like any big city. There are areas to avoid for sure. North of downtown is best and even better is north east. But not south. By the bye, my grandfather was violently murdered in the 90's he lived in a crummy area near samual blvd. kind of near fair park. Its pretty bad over there too. Also had a friend raped around park ln east of Greenville ave. So, if youre moving here, look up the crime stats. Trulia has good one that helps when moving, it goes by zip. AND look at the place before you move. Go there and look at the cars, listen for loudness. Check out your neighbors. Go at night and day time. You can tell if its nice area or not, its not rocket science!
what's funny is i could have told her to avoid skillman and audelia, shit jesus.
so yeah, it's not really hard to find safe places to live. just kind of scope out the neighborhood a bit. shops should be "nice," not filthy, the apartments should have nice clean exteriors. People's cars should look "newer" and not all be older and ill maintained. it's a judgement call you learn to make.
So, tl;dr narrow your search by looking at specific neighborhoods and consider your 3 most important things, maybe for you it will be Wrestling matches, School, and proximity to friends. Or maybe they are Work, School, shopping. I've found that to be a great way to figure out what area i really need to live, so i can then find a place i'd like to live.
hope that helps with the hunt.
(Edited 3 minutes later.)
Anonymous K replied with this 12 years ago, 5 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#470,966
@470,830 (squeegee !first/o5zA)
a) You don't need to rent to build credit. You can did it with other loans.
b) You don't know what the fuck you're talking about with interest. Interest rates on homes are around 4% APR right now. Even compounded daily on a 30-year fixed mortgage you're not spending as much on interest as you would be on an apartment. You're talking out your ass. Plus the house will most likely go up in value more than you pay in interest.
c) Of course you're going to have to pay to maintain the home. It's still worth it in the long run. And what's all this bullshit about fences? I've never lived anywhere that fences were required?
d) 20% is good but you're still talking out your ass. My brother and my sister both got houses and they both put down less than 10%. First time home buyers can get good deals.
Anonymous F replied with this 12 years ago, 26 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#470,967
at 4%apr a 100,000 mortgage costs you 171,869.51, with principle AND interest paid off. So it's costs you 71,869 to borrow 100,000 bucks.
So that's actually like spending $1.71 and getting back a dollar.
a) Go get a loan without credit or strong history of paying debts on time. like, a real one.
b) See mortgage calculator to see what 4%apr does to you over 30 year.
c) the fence was an example, as was roofing, foundations and air conditioning. All multiple thousands of dollars to repair or replace. Houses are expensive, and unless you're in a position of being able to PAY for random unknown expensive repairs then a house will likely be unaffordable. You can't just buy a house and expect to just pay for it, you have to pay to keep it up as well.
I would also be interested to know what kind of experience you have paying for home repairs and up keep. Do you have any direct experience with any of this or are you just speaking for your older sister?
d) good for them, all that does it make your over all interest payments lower. Had they pout more down they'd have saved a ton of money they are throwing away on interest. Sure you can but a house with NOTHING DOWN! but you don't do this because it IS just BETTER to buy a house out right. But, no one usually does this, because first time home owners don't have 200 grand just sitting around. So you put down as much as you can, and you pay the banks a lot of money to let you borrow the rest.
Anyway, believe me, don't believe me, but before you shit on everything i say and call yourself an expert
a) have you ever taken out a loan, if so, for how much?
b) you can just say a lot of things, but without any numbers and words like "most likely" i'm pretty sure you don't actually know what house values are doing in your area. You don't really start seing the real benefits of home ownership (on your pocket book) until after the house is paid off. Until then it's like paying for an apartment you have to pay to repair. 600 bucks a month is 600 bucks a month, once you factor in insurance and property taxes.
i bet you didn't factor in insurance costs and property taxes (oops!). there's actually a lot you're not accounting for, bud.
c) How much do you pay per year on maintenance on your house, i'll wait for you to go get your file and add up a years worth of maintenance work. Do do keep a file don't you? It's a lot to just "keep in your head."
d) What kind of down payment did you put on your house?
(Edited 2 minutes later.)
squeegee !first/o5zA double-posted this 12 years ago, 7 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#470,973
also, as long as we're using other people's anecdotes as our own,
my brother bought a house and put almost nothing down on it, and HE says apartments are cheaper because maintenance and utilities are so high that he can only afford to run electricity every other day! (this was actually true, he lost his job and was out of work for a bit and he almost lost his house because he ran out of savings because he had to fix a water main that burst under the house. Luckily his insurance paid for the hail damaged roof that year, but he spent much of that summer building a fence because his old one got blown apart by a storm!)
so that makes me right cause my brother my brother
(Edited 20 seconds later.)
squeegee !first/o5zA triple-posted this 12 years ago, 18 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^][v]#470,975
also i won't be a total dick, here are a few approximate numbers.
in 20xx when i had an apartment i paid 865 a month, or 10,380 on rent. My place was bills paid, so my real expenditure was actually just 10,380 yearly
my current house payments are about 480. that's, 5760. But i also pay utils, which are about $150 a month average, so 1,800, plus insurance, which is about 1200 i think, a year, plus property taxes which are around 1500 i'd guess.
I did have to have some plumbing work this year, that was 800, and i also bought a new washer and dryer, that was 1200. So far that's 12,260, almost 2 grand more than i would have spent in an apartment. And we're just getting started.
Anyway, but you're right. in 15 years i can probably sell it and earn back more than i spent on interest.
(Edited 30 seconds later.)
Anonymous M joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 16 hours later, 2 days after the original post[^][v]#471,012
@470,972 (squeegee !first/o5zA)
That's if you go with the 30-year mortgage and spread it out over the course of 30 years, not paying anything extra. Even if you look at the as $71,869 thrown away, how much would it have cost you to rent over the course of those same 30 years? $800/month on rent for 30 years is $288,000 and that money is thrown away. Or spend $171,000 and have a house worth $100,000 (or possibly more, as it may increase in value, and also keep up with inflation.) You have to pay for utilities either way. The only real worry is maintenance costs, but the money you save vs paying rent is worth it.
To be fair, it does depend on where you live. In areas where rent is cheap, it makes sense to save money in the short term vs coughing up the extra money to own a home, but in areas where mortgages are less than rent, it's no brainer ever when you factor in insurance and maintenance costs. You have to think in terms of opportunity costs, not just raw dollars.
Anonymous M double-posted this 12 years ago, 5 minutes later, 2 days after the original post[^][v]#471,013
@470,972 (squeegee !first/o5zA) > Go get a loan without credit or strong history of paying debts on time. like, a real one.
Also, I don't quite understand the point you're trying to make here. Why do you assume everyone's credit is shot? This only proves that some people have to rent because they have shitty credit.
squeegee !first/o5zA replied with this 12 years ago, 5 hours later, 2 days after the original post[^][v]#471,046
@471,012 (M)
why would someone rent for 30 years? I have not recommended that. I am merely recommending renting over buying until you have everything you need to buy: down payment, credit, experience. I have not said renting is superior, i have not said renting is cheaper over 30 years. I have said that renting is affordable, renting allows you to save some money, and renting is not a ball and chain like a 15 or a 30 year mortgage. renting allows you to be flexible when you're young and unsettled.
again, i have not said rent an apartment for 30 years. I have merely explained that when owing a house only part of the money you spend on it goes towards equity. you will not recoup repair and maintenance costs. you will not recoup property taxes and insurance costs. period. you will only recoup the principle.
As i said earlier, apartment living is cheaper, however you extract nothing back from it. home owning is more expensive, but you get value back out of it. They are two different things, and each has their own place, renting doesn't' work for everyone at every point in their life, neither does owning a home.
there is nothing wrong with either one, but neither should be promoted as the only way to go.
@previous (M)
I wasn't generalizing this statement, i was speaking directly to Anon K. I was suggesting that he go try to get this loan he's spouting off about without 3 lines of credit (i.e. years of payment history for rent, cable bills, phone bills, car notes, credit cards, etc, etc.).
But we're also talking about 18 year olds moving out on their own for the first time, i've not said anything about what i would recommend for someone who is 35, settled down, and has good credit.
when you're 22, move around, aren't settled into a career and just want out of mom and dad's house - maybe buying a place isn't the best idea. maybe renting is a good way to get started with very little tying you down.
(Edited 1 minute later.)
squeegee !first/o5zA double-posted this 12 years ago, 10 minutes later, 2 days after the original post[^][v]#471,047
also, this thread is titled "Advise for Apartment hunting", not "Should I Rent or Should I Buy?"
I didn't actually come here to argue the virtues of anything, so i'm not going to anymore.
@OP if you have any other questions about apartment hunting, i'm happy to give you my 2 cents.
@Anyone else- you want to argue a meta topic about home buying, go start a thread about it.
(Edited 32 seconds later.)
Anonymous H replied with this 12 years ago, 4 minutes later, 2 days after the original post[^][v]#471,049
@previous (squeegee !first/o5zA) > Far earlier in the thread, no one cared what catherine thought about anything. Thanks
Anonymous N joined in and replied with this 12 years ago, 16 hours later, 3 days after the original post[^][v]#471,173
@470,731 (squeegee !first/o5zA)
And don't forget the toilet paper.