Topic: Today's bible passage: Ezekiel 23:19-23:20

HaikerensGuide !0VegJ9Jl.Q started this discussion 13 years ago #26,128

Yet she turned to even greater prostitution, remembering her youth when she was a prostitute in Egypt. She lusted after lovers with genitals as large as a donkey's and emissions like those of a horse.

(Edited 1 minute later.)

buspup !!x+kkCmnF4 joined in and replied with this 13 years ago, 10 minutes later[^] [v] #395,264

I feel very inspired right now. Thank you.

imafaggot joined in and replied with this 13 years ago, 21 seconds later, 10 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #395,265

hurr durr old testament so irrelevant doesn't matter

Anonymous D joined in and replied with this 13 years ago, 16 minutes later, 27 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #395,270

@previous (imafaggot)
> implying that the entire bible isn't irrelevant

imafaggot replied with this 13 years ago, 7 minutes later, 34 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #395,272

@previous (D)
> implying that i wasn't acting like most christians who brush off the old testament whenever it gets dirty/barbaric

(Edited 28 seconds later.)

Anonymous E joined in and replied with this 13 years ago, 3 minutes later, 38 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #395,275

Yawn.

Anonymous F joined in and replied with this 13 years ago, 2 minutes later, 40 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #395,276

@395,272 (imafaggot)
> implying the old testament wasnt written to pander to jews

imafaggot replied with this 13 years ago, 49 seconds later, 41 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #395,278

@previous (F)
I never implied that. You have misread my post.

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 6 minutes later, 47 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #395,280

@395,272 (imafaggot)
> implying that I'm not going to fuck you in the butt for this

Anonymous G joined in and replied with this 13 years ago, 1 hour later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,313

How original OP!

http://minichan.org/topic/8162#reply_142480
http://minichan.org/topic/6256#reply_108326
http://minichan.org/topic/8543#reply_149746
http://minichan.org/topic/8341#reply_145799

HaikerensGuide !0VegJ9Jl.Q (OP) replied with this 13 years ago, 3 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,314

@previous (G)
Theirs lacks the context 23:19 provides.

buspup !!x+kkCmnF4 replied with this 13 years ago, 2 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,316

@395,313 (G)
Hey, its a crowd pleaser. He has to work with his audience, right?

Anonymous H joined in and replied with this 13 years ago, 10 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,320

Didn't that part end with god smiting her for fornication or something like that?

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 10 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,330

@previous (H)
Probably. Why would he even make her if he was just going to end up hating and smiting her anyway?

buspup !!x+kkCmnF4 replied with this 13 years ago, 6 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,331

@previous (D)
Didnt god do that a lot? Like didn't he harden the Pharaohs heart and then punish him for not releasing the slaves?

Anonymous H replied with this 13 years ago, 7 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,341

@395,330 (D)

Well evolution and mutation are proven facts and if god is real, it means critters mutate like crazy and most of them god has to cull off to get rid of the unfit ones.

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 21 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,360

@previous (H)
But if he's omniscient, shouldn't he have known that this would happen, and that was just going to have to condemn his creations to hell? Why would he create them knowing that they were bound for hell?

@395,331 (buspup !!x+kkCmnF4)
Yes! He also has a deal with Satan to take to hell and torture the souls he doesn't approve of (that he knew would turn out that way).

That or Satan is more powerful than him, so the omnipotent part doesn't work.

(Edited 36 seconds later.)

buspup !!x+kkCmnF4 replied with this 13 years ago, 3 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,361

@previous (D)
Tell me if this is true: I head that before Jesus existed, Satan felt bad for humans because no one went to heaven at that time. So he nagged God until God decided to send himself down as Jesus, so that he could experience the human condition. After Jesus was killed, some people went to heaven.

Anonymous H replied with this 13 years ago, 2 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,363

@395,360 (D)

I don't think he can time travel.

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 1 minute later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,365

@395,361 (buspup !!x+kkCmnF4)
No idea, sorry.

Anonymous D double-posted this 13 years ago, 2 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,366

@395,363 (H)
Do you know what omniscient means? It means knowing everything. Were he truly omniscient, he would have known that in creating humans and giving them free will, that some would deviate.

Therefore: god made certain actions worthy of banishment to hell yet he is the one who enabled those actions to be done in the first place!

buspup !!x+kkCmnF4 replied with this 13 years ago, 57 seconds later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,367

@previous (D)
Very true.

Anonymous H replied with this 13 years ago, 5 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,372

@395,366 (D)

If time is not a travelable dimension, and he can merely see everything as it is now, then he wouldn't know the future.

And if that's not enough, this video explores how if god doesn't know something, he wouldn't know he didn't know it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODetOE6cbbc

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 6 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,374

@previous (H)
But in giving humans free will, his omiscence would have given him the ability to predict that it would cause unfavourable deviations. Shit, you don't even need to be omniscient to know that free will results in deviation.

Question: why would he give people free will, knowing that free will inherently means that people will behave differently, and punish those deviate in ways that he didn't like?

There's no way around it: god giving humans free will and punishing them for sins he knew they'd commit as a result of this is highly irrational.

Anonymous H replied with this 13 years ago, 12 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,382

@previous (D)

> Question: why would he give people free will, knowing that free will inherently means that people will behave differently, and punish those deviate in ways that he didn't like?
>

Well it's a lot more complicated, such as Yahweh by description could never be the creator of the universe, and human's don't have the free will they think they do. But in its simplest form, it's basically about keeping people who make the choices you agree with of their free will and destroying those who don't, generating lots of people and then culling the ones Yahweh didn't like.

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 6 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,387

@previous (H)
You're not attacking my point directly, you're just dancing around by quibbling about the exact definition of related terms.

It's a simple premise:

- At some point god decides that there are behaviours that he does not like
- God created humans
- God gives humans free will
- God is annoyed when the use of this free will results in humans doing things that he doesn't like
- God punishes humans for exercising the free will that he gave them for violating the rules that he invented

Your portrayal of god as some sort of cosmic culler does nothing to debunk this logic. Humans wouldn't need "culling" if he had not given them the ability to think for themselves in the first place. Therefore, his supposed need to cull people was entirely avoidable.

(Edited 28 seconds later.)

Anonymous I joined in and replied with this 13 years ago, 12 hours later, 17 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,578

> doesn't know that this story is an allegory of the nation of israel
> deems self competent to speak at length on the bible and theology

Anonymous B replied with this 13 years ago, 2 hours later, 19 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,605

@previous (I)
Tell us which of those stories are allegories, and which are not.

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 33 minutes later, 19 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,619

@previous (B)
It depends entirely on one's interpretation, lol.

Anonymous I replied with this 13 years ago, 2 hours later, 22 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,651

@395,605 (B)
> those
???

@previous (D)
> tradition, scholarship
> whatever i want lel

squeegee joined in and replied with this 13 years ago, 11 minutes later, 22 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,657

@395,578 (I)
> super worried people misunderstand his ghost stories

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 2 minutes later, 22 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,658

@395,651 (I)
> only my interpretation is correct
> therefore the bible isn't subjective at all
lol okay pal

squeegee replied with this 13 years ago, 5 minutes later, 23 hours after the original post[^] [v] #395,659

I can't believe people go to school for this stuff. But, I guess if they teach university courses on the Simpsons and South Park you can get a degree in anything.

Anonymous B replied with this 13 years ago, 1 hour later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #395,676

@395,651 (I)
Which are allegories, besides this?

Anonymous I replied with this 13 years ago, 14 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #396,051

@395,658 (D)
> the traditions handed down by the apostles
> my opinions

ho ho ho

> attempt to show objective meaning of bible
> your subjective lol

Anonymous I double-posted this 13 years ago, 2 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #396,052

@395,676 (B)
Much/most prophecy.

Many of the deuterocanonical books.

Parables and poetry.

Anonymous K joined in and replied with this 13 years ago, 44 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #396,057

@396,051 (I)
> the traditions handed down by the apostles
> ezekiel
wtf?

soooo sad joined in and replied with this 13 years ago, 4 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #396,082

@395,361 (buspup !!x+kkCmnF4)
I cannot believe you would post such ridiculous rubbish.....shame on you..

buspup !!x+kkCmnF4 replied with this 13 years ago, 3 hours later, 2 days after the original post[^] [v] #396,113

@previous (soooo sad)
wait, how is it ridiculous?

Anonymous I replied with this 13 years ago, 5 hours later, 2 days after the original post[^] [v] #396,217

@396,057 (K)
I wasn't commenting on this particular passage when I wrote that, but on "out of the entire bible, tell me what is what".

But yeah the Church Fathers wrote commentaries on OT scripture that represent apostolic traditions

Anonymous K replied with this 13 years ago, 52 minutes later, 2 days after the original post[^] [v] #396,237

@previous (I)
I find your faith in a 2000 year long game of telephone amusing.

Anonymous I replied with this 13 years ago, 3 days later, 5 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,103

@previous (K)
Fortunately, each player writes down what they mean as well, and that gets passed along, too.

Anonymous K replied with this 13 years ago, 16 hours later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,325

@previous (I)
Are these the same guys who can't even get their Jesus stories to agree with each other?

Anonymous B replied with this 13 years ago, 15 minutes later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,326

@previous (K)
lol yes.

Anonymous I replied with this 13 years ago, 3 minutes later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,328

@397,325 (K)
but they do!

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 3 minutes later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,329

@previous (I)
Then why are there hundreds of different strains of Christianity?

@396,237 (K)
I lol'd.

Anonymous B replied with this 13 years ago, 2 minutes later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,331

@previous (D)
they also disagree on what happened during certain events, such as Christ's resurrection.

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 1 minute later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,332

@previous (B)
damlol. If you can't even agree on the basic shit then you can't really say that your religion isn't subjective.

Anonymous B replied with this 13 years ago, 8 minutes later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,336

@previous (D)
You really cant. To be fair, many of these accounts were written decades after Jesus died, which makes them even more questionable.

Anonymous I replied with this 13 years ago, 2 hours later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,353

@397,329 (D)
Some people "twist scripture to their own destruction"

Anonymous K replied with this 13 years ago, 4 hours later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,378

@397,331 (B)
It's not just the resurrection. It's all over. Those guys don't even wait for Jesus to be born before they start inserting popular myths and contradictory details into the story. I wouldn't trust the early church to accurately preserve Jesus' shopping list.

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 10 minutes later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,379

@397,353 (I)
I bet they're saying the same thing about you...

Anonymous F replied with this 13 years ago, 15 minutes later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #397,380

oh look, its this thread. AGAIN.

Anonymous I replied with this 13 years ago, 14 hours later, 1 week after the original post[^] [v] #397,486

@397,379 (D)
yes but they're wrong lol

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 2 minutes later, 1 week after the original post[^] [v] #397,489

@previous (I)
I bet they're saying the same thing about you...

Anonymous I replied with this 13 years ago, 9 hours later, 1 week after the original post[^] [v] #397,803

@previous (D)
and the holocaust deniers say normal people are retarded

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 10 minutes later, 1 week after the original post[^] [v] #397,809

@previous (I)
But holocaust deniers base their claims on questionable evidence, whereas with christians all of them are going off of questionable evidence.

(Edited 58 seconds later.)

Anonymous I replied with this 13 years ago, 16 minutes later, 1 week after the original post[^] [v] #397,813

@previous (D)
But that's not the case! Most Protestants hold to a doctrine known as "sola scriptura", meaning they base their doctrine entirely on the Bible, without taking into account the traditions and practices of the early church.

(Edited 13 seconds later.)

Anonymous D replied with this 13 years ago, 10 minutes later, 1 week after the original post[^] [v] #397,818

@previous (I)
> the bible
which is obviously a completely objective and accurate source of information!

Anonymous K replied with this 13 years ago, 53 seconds later, 1 week after the original post[^] [v] #397,819

@397,803 (I)
> holocaust deniers say other people are retarded
> therefore people saying I'm wrong are wrong
impeccable logic

Anonymous B replied with this 13 years ago, 7 hours later, 1 week after the original post[^] [v] #397,833

@previous (K)
lol

Anonymous I replied with this 13 years ago, 8 hours later, 1 week after the original post[^] [v] #398,004

@397,818 (D)
Since the argument is whose doctrine is most accurate to the bible, that is an irrelevant point to make.

@397,819 (K)
i wonder if you actually got my point and are just ignoring it, or if you really are just an idiot

Minichan