Topic: I found a website with frequently asked questions about the legality of prayer in school.
swamplights !!V3J448+/B started this discussion 15 years ago#11,184
Skim this and answer this question. If all of that is true, why would Ron Paul sponsor a constitutional amendment which would allow students to pray privately in public schools? Isn't it already legal? Walloftext ahead.
Prayer in School - A Review of Current Case Law & Constitutional Principles
Is prayer in school totally outlawed? Are there times when prayer in school is allowed? It seems many people are confused by the current state of the law regarding prayer in public schools. The purpose of this website is to provide guidelines for the lawful exercise of prayer in particular situations.
Prayer in School - Prayer During Non-instructional Time
Students may pray when not engaged in school activities or instruction, subject to the same rules designed to prevent material disruption of the educational program that are applied to other privately initiated expressive activities. Among other things, students may read their Bibles or other scriptures, say grace before meals, and pray or study religious materials with fellow students during recess, the lunch hour, or other non-instructional time to the same extent that they may engage in nonreligious activities. While school authorities may impose rules of order and pedagogical restrictions on student activities, they may not discriminate against student prayer or religious speech in applying such rules and restrictions.
Prayer in School - Organized Prayer Groups and Activities
Students may organize prayer groups, religious clubs, and "see you at the pole" gatherings before school to the same extent that students are permitted to organize other non-curricular student activities groups. Such groups must be given the same access to school facilities for assembling as is given to other non-curricular groups, without discrimination because of the religious content of their expression. School authorities possess substantial discretion concerning whether to permit the use of school media for student advertising or announcements regarding non-curricular activities. However, where student groups that meet for nonreligious activities are permitted to advertise or announce their meetings-for example, by advertising in a student newspaper, making announcements on a student activities bulletin board or public address system, or handing out leaflets-school authorities may not discriminate against groups who meet to pray. School authorities may disclaim sponsorship of non-curricular groups and events, provided they administer such disclaimers in a manner that neither favors nor disfavors groups that meet to engage in prayer or religious speech.
Prayer in School - Teachers, Administrators, and other School Employees
When acting in their official capacities as representatives of the state, teachers, school administrators, and other school employees are prohibited by the Establishment Clause from encouraging or discouraging prayer, and from actively participating in such activity with students. Teachers may, however, take part in religious activities where the overall context makes clear that they are not participating in their official capacities. Before school or during lunch, for example, teachers may meet with other teachers for prayer or Bible study to the same extent that they may engage in other conversation or nonreligious activities. Similarly, teachers may participate in their personal capacities in privately sponsored baccalaureate ceremonies.
Prayer in School - Moments of Silence
If a school has a "minute of silence" or other quiet periods during the school day, students are free to pray silently, or not to pray, during these periods of time. Teachers and other school employees may neither encourage nor discourage students from praying during such time periods.
cat /dev/null !COOOOOLbus joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 6 hours later[^][v]#201,322
tealdeer
Anonymous C joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 5 minutes later, 6 hours after the original post[^][v]#201,335
prayer is just wishing with conviction
KBR !!7Enb4sycc joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 13 minutes later, 7 hours after the original post[^][v]#201,354
Prayer in school is already legal, so leave it that way, with no changes to "protect" it!
dreamworks !AUIkTW/L46 joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 2 minutes later, 7 hours after the original post[^][v]#201,358
andrew ryan 2012
StatistSocialist3000 joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 3 hours later, 10 hours after the original post[^][v]#201,524
Where is that info sourced from? Is it even true?
Breakfast of Champions !!snnYcROO9 joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 50 minutes later, 11 hours after the original post[^][v]#201,545
#r,onpaul2012 BITCH!!
sluggy joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 30 minutes later, 11 hours after the original post[^][v]#201,565
Yes. Private prayer in school is perfectly legal. It is illegal for a public school to endorse a particular religion by having a christian prayer service, or just a prayer before class or something like that.
If children want to prayer privately on their own time, there is no legal obligation to stop them. Further, its illegal to stop them from praying privately (assuming its at an appropriate time.)
Tekamine !AnRbswGQv. joined in and replied with this 15 years ago, 7 hours later, 19 hours after the original post[^][v]#201,670
I once got chastised in school for eating my dinner before saying grace. I remember them bollocking me and me going home to my mother upset. She changed my school after that. Guess thats what you have to expect in C of E schools.
swamplights !!V3J448+/B (OP) replied with this 15 years ago, 4 hours later, 23 hours after the original post[^][v]#201,939
@201,354 (KBR !!7Enb4sycc) @201,565 (sluggy)
I was just wondering why an amendment was needed.
swamplights !!V3J448+/B (OP) double-posted this 15 years ago, 1 minute later, 23 hours after the original post[^][v]#201,940
@201,524 (StatistSocialist3000)
I found it here. Have you researched any of this to see if it's true?
I barely ever got in trouble at school. I think the only real trouble I got in was when me and a friend made a fake myspace impersonating a teacher and made her out to be a bitter alcoholic obsessed with material goods and plastic surgery. They nearly kicked us out, about a fortnight before GCSE tests started. I guess they only didn't ebcause we were predicted to get high grades.
swamplights !!V3J448+/B (OP) replied with this 15 years ago, 1 minute later, 23 hours after the original post[^][v]#201,943
@201,524 (StatistSocialist3000)
I also found this.
Because of the constitutional concerns regarding separation of church and state, the issue of school prayer is a controversial one. However, there is a crucial difference between government speech endorsing religion, which the Establishment Clause forbids, and private speech endorsing religion, which the Free Speech and Free Exercise Clauses protect.
School districts must allow religious speech on the same terms as they allow other speech. Therefore, students have the same right to engage in individual or group prayer and religious discussion during the school day as they do to engage in other comparable activities. A public school may not suppress or exclude private student speech for the sole reason that the speech contains a religious perspective. Although public school officials may not promote or initiate student prayer or require unwilling students to participate in prayer, they may support and give official recognition to this nation's collective religious heritage without risking a violation of the Establishment Clause.