Topic: Whom will win in the war between Shoigu and Prigozhin?
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU started this discussion 2 years ago #111,557
Please vote, the fate of Russia depends on democracy prevailing here.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) double-posted this 2 years ago, 2 minutes later[^] [v] #1,239,537
Anonymous B joined in and replied with this 2 years ago, 2 hours later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,628
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) replied with this 2 years ago, 15 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,630
Anonymous C joined in and replied with this 2 years ago, 1 hour later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,641
Awesome, inb4 Father Merrin claims the audio is an AI deepfake or the Wagner guy is a US/NATO puppet
Father Merrin !DxwCZwukMY joined in and replied with this 2 years ago, 6 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,644
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) replied with this 2 years ago, 6 hours later, 11 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,740
OK I am going to go to bed. If DC gets nuked and I die, I hereby bequeath $1 to the forum, to be taken out of my annual moderator salary. Don't spend it all in one place.
Hopefully things will make more sense in the morning but some things seem to have clarity already: Prigozhin wants to control the Russian military, Putin is stuck between a rock and a hard place, and his upcoming speech will determine who lives and dies at the upper echelons of power. Really it seems like it will decide if this is a relatively bloodless uh...organizational restructuring of the Russian military, or a full blown Civil war/coup.
Moral of the story: always tip your caterer.
Hopefully things will make more sense in the morning but some things seem to have clarity already: Prigozhin wants to control the Russian military, Putin is stuck between a rock and a hard place, and his upcoming speech will determine who lives and dies at the upper echelons of power. Really it seems like it will decide if this is a relatively bloodless uh...organizational restructuring of the Russian military, or a full blown Civil war/coup.
Moral of the story: always tip your caterer.
(Edited 7 minutes later.)
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 3 minutes later, 11 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,741
@previous (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
This isn't WWIII. Literally nothing is going to happen. Go to bed.
This isn't WWIII. Literally nothing is going to happen. Go to bed.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) replied with this 2 years ago, 3 minutes later, 11 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,742
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) double-posted this 2 years ago, 21 minutes later, 11 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,744
Putin calls this an act of treason that will be put down. He's correct but he also seems a little old and out of touch with the situation here? It's hard to explain, idk. We'll see what happens but it is very likely to be an extremely unpleasant experience for everyone.
Anonymous C replied with this 2 years ago, 1 hour later, 13 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,753
Voronezh is now under insurgent control. Lots of places I’ve never heard of and people I’ve never heard of in my Twitter feed and barely any mainstream news coverage. Getting all this from random blue checks and dubious Telegram screenshots.
Taking this all with a grain of salt.
Taking this all with a grain of salt.
Anonymous F joined in and replied with this 2 years ago, 4 hours later, 18 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,758
This is absolutely hilarious. Russia is so shit that not only does it fail to beat a weaker version of itself, but when it tries to do so the strain is so bad that tbey start fighting amongst themselves. 😂😂😂
Fantastic to see Putin humiliated, and his vanity invasion failing even more.
Fantastic to see Putin humiliated, and his vanity invasion failing even more.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) replied with this 2 years ago, 2 hours later, 20 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,771
One thing Putin may be learning is that it is very fun to invade people, but not very fun to be invaded by people. Whom could have guessed?
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 26 minutes later, 21 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,775
@1,239,758 (F)
Father Merrin defends everything Putin does.
Russia shows signs of weakness. Moments later Father Merrin is gone. What's happened?
Father Merrin defends everything Putin does.
Russia shows signs of weakness. Moments later Father Merrin is gone. What's happened?
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) replied with this 2 years ago, 6 minutes later, 21 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,779
@previous (D)
Probably as diplomatic staff with a family in Russia, he is quite busy at the moment and posting on minichan dot net is not high on his to-do list.
Probably as diplomatic staff with a family in Russia, he is quite busy at the moment and posting on minichan dot net is not high on his to-do list.
Anonymous F replied with this 2 years ago, 10 minutes later, 21 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,780
@1,239,775 (D)
I'm eager to see his response, though! The recent trend of him mournfully asking "How could the West do this? Ukraine is suffering. " while Russian bombs blow up Ukrainians was quite a leap of logic. So he will surely have an explanation for this that makes Putin look like a competent leader and lays the blame at those insidious Americans.
@1,239,771 (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
His own people, no less! What a failure, how does he plan on running a puppet state when he can't even run his own? 😂
I'm eager to see his response, though! The recent trend of him mournfully asking "How could the West do this? Ukraine is suffering. " while Russian bombs blow up Ukrainians was quite a leap of logic. So he will surely have an explanation for this that makes Putin look like a competent leader and lays the blame at those insidious Americans.
@1,239,771 (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
His own people, no less! What a failure, how does he plan on running a puppet state when he can't even run his own? 😂
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 5 minutes later, 21 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,781
@1,239,779 (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
Lol
@previous (F)
His contortions of logic are, if anything, entertaining.
Lol
@previous (F)
His contortions of logic are, if anything, entertaining.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) replied with this 2 years ago, 44 minutes later, 22 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,782
Ok now Prigozhin is apparently saying he's turning around??? I am so confused. Maybe this means he worked out something with Putin re: Shoigu and the MoD? Or something else. This is all so bizarre.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U joined in and replied with this 2 years ago, 37 minutes later, 23 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,784
Storm in a teacup.
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 12 minutes later, 23 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,786
Anonymous F replied with this 2 years ago, 4 minutes later, 23 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,788
@1,239,784 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
Yeah, Dave, this is all fine. It's normal for one of a country's military leaders to march on the capital because he got into an argument with the government. This happens all time!
Yeah, Dave, this is all fine. It's normal for one of a country's military leaders to march on the capital because he got into an argument with the government. This happens all time!
(Edited 26 seconds later.)
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 2 years ago, 2 minutes later, 23 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,790
Anonymous F replied with this 2 years ago, 25 minutes later, 23 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,792
@previous (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
I think you are a good example of the depressing truth that, while someone can be highly educated and intelligent, that is little protection against irrational beliefs.
This situation was not normal, it should not happen. It is not normal or good for a country's own soldiers to march against the government, even if it is quickly negotiated away. You're obviously playing up the nonchalant attitude on here to troll people, but the disturbing part is that I think you genuinely think this. You remind me, suddenly, of those Trump people who thought that an angry mob storming the Capitol was a non-issue.
I think you are a good example of the depressing truth that, while someone can be highly educated and intelligent, that is little protection against irrational beliefs.
This situation was not normal, it should not happen. It is not normal or good for a country's own soldiers to march against the government, even if it is quickly negotiated away. You're obviously playing up the nonchalant attitude on here to troll people, but the disturbing part is that I think you genuinely think this. You remind me, suddenly, of those Trump people who thought that an angry mob storming the Capitol was a non-issue.
Anonymous H joined in and replied with this 2 years ago, 3 minutes later, 23 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,793
@1,239,784 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
> Storm in a teacup.
You were wrong about Putin invading Ukraine. What makes you certain about this?
> Storm in a teacup.
You were wrong about Putin invading Ukraine. What makes you certain about this?
Anonymous B replied with this 2 years ago, 31 seconds later, 23 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,794
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66006860
Russia: Wagner chief Yevgeny Prigozhin calls halt to Moscow advance
Russia: Wagner chief Yevgeny Prigozhin calls halt to Moscow advance
Anonymous H replied with this 2 years ago, 2 minutes later, 23 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,796
@1,239,792 (F)
"angry mob storming the Capitol was a non-issue."
Straw man.
A small group of people, strolling calmly, some in fancy dress, being ushered in by security is not an "angry mob".
"angry mob storming the Capitol was a non-issue."
Straw man.
A small group of people, strolling calmly, some in fancy dress, being ushered in by security is not an "angry mob".
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 13 seconds later, 23 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,797
@1,239,792 (F)
> while someone can be highly educated and intelligent, that is little protection against irrational beliefs.
> intelligent
lol
> while someone can be highly educated and intelligent, that is little protection against irrational beliefs.
> intelligent
lol
Anonymous D double-posted this 2 years ago, 3 minutes later, 23 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,798
@1,239,796 (H)
@1,239,792 (F)
Remember when Leftists bombed the US capitol and the Pentagon?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weather_Underground
@1,239,792 (F)
Remember when Leftists bombed the US capitol and the Pentagon?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weather_Underground
(Edited 1 minute later.)
Anonymous F replied with this 2 years ago, 2 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,799
@previous (D)
I am going to take a bold stance here, and say that any interference with the Capitol is not okay. Even if it's only, as Anon H put it, just a friendly fancy dress party that gets out of hand.
I am going to take a bold stance here, and say that any interference with the Capitol is not okay. Even if it's only, as Anon H put it, just a friendly fancy dress party that gets out of hand.
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 8 seconds later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,800
> In 1973, the government requested dropping charges against most of the WUO members. The requests cited a recent decision by the Supreme Court of the United States that barred electronic surveillance without a court order.
Dropping charges because the electronic surveillance occurred without a court order. Wow! What a world we live in!
Dropping charges because the electronic surveillance occurred without a court order. Wow! What a world we live in!
Anonymous D double-posted this 2 years ago, 3 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,801
@1,239,799 (F)
> any interference with the Capitol is not okay
That line of reasoning got peaceful protesters arrested while protesting Charles' coronation a few months back. Because they were "interfering" with the event.
> any interference with the Capitol is not okay
That line of reasoning got peaceful protesters arrested while protesting Charles' coronation a few months back. Because they were "interfering" with the event.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 2 years ago, 2 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,802
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 1 second later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,803
Leftists bomb multiple government buildings and most charges were dropped.
Meme lord rightists are let into the capitol and now more than a thousand are serving prison sentences.
Meme lord rightists are let into the capitol and now more than a thousand are serving prison sentences.
(Edited 37 seconds later.)
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) replied with this 2 years ago, 4 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,804
Everyone shut the fuck up about America, this is a Russia thread. Thanks.
@1,239,784 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
The reporting is confused now but it seems like Putin struck a deal to axe Shoigu and Gerasimov and replace them with new people, presumably people that Prigozhin approves of. Do you think that will be enough to permanently resolve the dispute here? I've no doubt that Shoigu and Gerasimov were not the two most competent military strategists in all of Russia, but also it seems like the Russian military as a whole isn't in great shape, and there are just hard material limits on what they can actually do regardless of who is head of MoD.
@1,239,784 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
The reporting is confused now but it seems like Putin struck a deal to axe Shoigu and Gerasimov and replace them with new people, presumably people that Prigozhin approves of. Do you think that will be enough to permanently resolve the dispute here? I've no doubt that Shoigu and Gerasimov were not the two most competent military strategists in all of Russia, but also it seems like the Russian military as a whole isn't in great shape, and there are just hard material limits on what they can actually do regardless of who is head of MoD.
(Edited 20 seconds later.)
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 2 years ago, 19 seconds later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,805
@1,239,792 (F)
Russia is a democracy and everyone, including Private Military Companies, has the right to peacefully protest, up to and including driving your bike, car, tractor or tank towards Moscow.
Bless you for the input friend.
Russia is a democracy and everyone, including Private Military Companies, has the right to peacefully protest, up to and including driving your bike, car, tractor or tank towards Moscow.
Bless you for the input friend.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U double-posted this 2 years ago, 2 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,807
@1,239,792 (F)
> It is not normal or good for a country's own soldiers to march against the government
I agree. But Wagner are not "Russia's own soldiers", they are a private military company, and Vladimir Putin is not their commander-in-chief, so why are you making such a spectacle of yourself?
> It is not normal or good for a country's own soldiers to march against the government
I agree. But Wagner are not "Russia's own soldiers", they are a private military company, and Vladimir Putin is not their commander-in-chief, so why are you making such a spectacle of yourself?
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) replied with this 2 years ago, 24 seconds later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,808
@1,239,792 (F)
It seems like you are taking Dave seriously or literally. Please refrain from committing that error in the future and you will appreciate your experience here more.
Thanks.
It seems like you are taking Dave seriously or literally. Please refrain from committing that error in the future and you will appreciate your experience here more.
Thanks.
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 33 seconds later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,809
@1,239,804 (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
> Everyone shut the fuck up about America, this is a Russia thread. Thanks.
Huh? According to Dave we can't talk about Russia without mentioning America every other sentence. America's just that important.
> Everyone shut the fuck up about America, this is a Russia thread. Thanks.
Huh? According to Dave we can't talk about Russia without mentioning America every other sentence. America's just that important.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 2 years ago, 2 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,810
@1,239,804 (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
> The reporting is confused now but it seems like Putin struck a deal to axe Shoigu and Gerasimov and replace them with new people, presumably people that Prigozhin approves of. Do you think that will be enough to permanently resolve the dispute here?
No idea, need to wait for more details of the agreement to come out. Literally the only way Russia can lose this war is by something like what happened today: internal chaos and in-fighting. Prigozhin knows that and has used it as leverage. We need to wait and see what he got out of it before making any conclusions about what lies ahead.
> The reporting is confused now but it seems like Putin struck a deal to axe Shoigu and Gerasimov and replace them with new people, presumably people that Prigozhin approves of. Do you think that will be enough to permanently resolve the dispute here?
No idea, need to wait for more details of the agreement to come out. Literally the only way Russia can lose this war is by something like what happened today: internal chaos and in-fighting. Prigozhin knows that and has used it as leverage. We need to wait and see what he got out of it before making any conclusions about what lies ahead.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) replied with this 2 years ago, 29 seconds later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,812
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 43 seconds later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,813
@1,239,810 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
> We need to wait and see what he got out of it before making any conclusions
You must be new here!
> We need to wait and see what he got out of it before making any conclusions
You must be new here!
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 2 years ago, 1 minute later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,814
By the way can we all just take a moment to appreciate that for about 10 hours today, the West's greatest hero was a guy who prior to last night was by their own description a "genocidal and psychopathic mass murderer"? That as much as anything else made me chortle today.
(Edited 40 seconds later.)
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 3 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,815
@previous (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
I never would've heard of any of this if not through minichan. Sorry, but Russia isn't nearly as relevant as you think.
I never would've heard of any of this if not through minichan. Sorry, but Russia isn't nearly as relevant as you think.
Anonymous F replied with this 2 years ago, 1 minute later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,816
@1,239,808 (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
I said in that reply that I am aware he is trolling, thank you. What I am saying is I think he really does downplay the significance of this.
@1,239,810 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
Case in point, you are blowing this off like it's just a bit of clever diplomacy. Well, maybe it is by Russian standards, but I do not think this is a sign of a very stable country or government.
I said in that reply that I am aware he is trolling, thank you. What I am saying is I think he really does downplay the significance of this.
@1,239,810 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
Case in point, you are blowing this off like it's just a bit of clever diplomacy. Well, maybe it is by Russian standards, but I do not think this is a sign of a very stable country or government.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU (OP) replied with this 2 years ago, 1 minute later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,817
@1,239,810 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
That makes sense. I will probably bug you with more questions once some of this has settled down, or if it picks up again.
@1,239,814 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
Whomst was calling him a hero? The average western response has been confusion and maybe some schadenfreude but I don't think people were imagining Prigozhin and Zelenskyy smiling and signing peace accords on Monday.
That makes sense. I will probably bug you with more questions once some of this has settled down, or if it picks up again.
@1,239,814 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
Whomst was calling him a hero? The average western response has been confusion and maybe some schadenfreude but I don't think people were imagining Prigozhin and Zelenskyy smiling and signing peace accords on Monday.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 2 years ago, 31 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,827
@1,239,815 (D)
> I never would've heard of any of this if not through minichan. Sorry, but Russia isn't nearly as relevant as you think.
Your basis for concluding that Russia is irrelevant is that you wouldn't have known about arguably the biggest news event of this year if not for spending your life on Minichan? No possible comment of mine will improve on that.
> I never would've heard of any of this if not through minichan. Sorry, but Russia isn't nearly as relevant as you think.
Your basis for concluding that Russia is irrelevant is that you wouldn't have known about arguably the biggest news event of this year if not for spending your life on Minichan? No possible comment of mine will improve on that.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U double-posted this 2 years ago, 2 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,829
@1,239,816 (F)
> Case in point, you are blowing this off like it's just a bit of clever diplomacy.
It is. That it's made you seethe with rage because you hoped a civil war was going to break out is only the complimentary chocolate mint at the end of an agreeable meal.
> Case in point, you are blowing this off like it's just a bit of clever diplomacy.
It is. That it's made you seethe with rage because you hoped a civil war was going to break out is only the complimentary chocolate mint at the end of an agreeable meal.
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 13 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,831
@1,239,827 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
The wealthiest nation on earth need not concern itself with the happenings of a nation that collapsed over 30 years ago. No amount of walls of text from you will ever change that.
The wealthiest nation on earth need not concern itself with the happenings of a nation that collapsed over 30 years ago. No amount of walls of text from you will ever change that.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 2 years ago, 9 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,832
@previous (D)
> The wealthiest nation on earth...
...leads the developed world in squalid poverty:
https://youtube.com/watch?v=yRWmKh13b50
> The wealthiest nation on earth...
...leads the developed world in squalid poverty:
https://youtube.com/watch?v=yRWmKh13b50
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 4 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,833
Anonymous H replied with this 2 years ago, 2 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,834
@1,239,802 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
I'm asking you how you can be certain that the whole of Russia is united behind Putin. It didn't happen this time, but why is a civil war so improbable? I would genuinely like to know from somebody who actually lives there.
I'm asking you how you can be certain that the whole of Russia is united behind Putin. It didn't happen this time, but why is a civil war so improbable? I would genuinely like to know from somebody who actually lives there.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 2 years ago, 11 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,835
@previous (H)
Because the vast, vast majority of Russians support Vladimir Putin (Moscow and St Petersburg, where most anti-Putin people live, comprise less than 9% of the Russian population). And today's events have only increased that support for him.
Because the vast, vast majority of Russians support Vladimir Putin (Moscow and St Petersburg, where most anti-Putin people live, comprise less than 9% of the Russian population). And today's events have only increased that support for him.
Anonymous C replied with this 2 years ago, 1 hour later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,841
@previous (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
Does popular support even matter when the powerbrokers are banksters, generals, and oligarchs?
Democracy in Russia is a farce.
Does popular support even matter when the powerbrokers are banksters, generals, and oligarchs?
Democracy in Russia is a farce.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 2 years ago, 12 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,849
@previous (C)
> Does popular support even matter when the powerbrokers are banksters, generals, and oligarchs?
Yes, as today proved. A jackass with his own PMC turned right around when he realised his little insurrection had fuck-all support from the people.
> Does popular support even matter when the powerbrokers are banksters, generals, and oligarchs?
Yes, as today proved. A jackass with his own PMC turned right around when he realised his little insurrection had fuck-all support from the people.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U double-posted this 2 years ago, 1 minute later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,850
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U triple-posted this 2 years ago, 40 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,863
Ah well, they had a good run.Anonymous C replied with this 2 years ago, 2 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,892
@1,239,850 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
Voted in, and voted out. The fact he even won the GOP nomination is proof enough that peoples’ voices matter in the USA.
In Russia you have Putin or some random lady who is a Putin supporter running to present the illusion of choice. Meanwhile Navalny is poisoned, and imprisoned.
Voted in, and voted out. The fact he even won the GOP nomination is proof enough that peoples’ voices matter in the USA.
In Russia you have Putin or some random lady who is a Putin supporter running to present the illusion of choice. Meanwhile Navalny is poisoned, and imprisoned.
Anonymous D replied with this 2 years ago, 16 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,239,899
@previous (C)
The last election we saw the choice between a reality TV show host and a senile 80-year-old man who voted for the war on drugs, mandatory minimum sentencing and so on before he succumbed to dementia decades ago.
The situation may be better than having only one "choice", as in Russia's case, but not by much.
The last election we saw the choice between a reality TV show host and a senile 80-year-old man who voted for the war on drugs, mandatory minimum sentencing and so on before he succumbed to dementia decades ago.
The situation may be better than having only one "choice", as in Russia's case, but not by much.