Topic: Charles Bukowski
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC started this discussion 5 years ago #102,115
Has anyone here read any of his books? How were they? Were they pretentious?
jodie !foster2PAQ joined in and replied with this 5 years ago, 27 seconds later[^] [v] #1,154,101
yes
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 8 minutes later, 8 minutes after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,103
@previous (jodie !foster2PAQ)
Which did you read? Were they worth reading? Im asking because one of his books is on sale and I'm wondering if I should buy
Which did you read? Were they worth reading? Im asking because one of his books is on sale and I'm wondering if I should buy
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U joined in and replied with this 5 years ago, 1 hour later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,110
@OP
> Has anyone here read any of his books? How were they? Were they pretentious?
Ham on Rye is one of the best books I've ever read. That's his masterpiece. After that, Factotum and Post Office are worth reading, they're also his 'Henry Chinaski' alter ego.
And "pretentious"? Fuck me, he's the opposite of pretentious. No idea whoever suggested that. His literary hero and model was Hemingway, it's brutally blunt writing.
> Has anyone here read any of his books? How were they? Were they pretentious?
Ham on Rye is one of the best books I've ever read. That's his masterpiece. After that, Factotum and Post Office are worth reading, they're also his 'Henry Chinaski' alter ego.
And "pretentious"? Fuck me, he's the opposite of pretentious. No idea whoever suggested that. His literary hero and model was Hemingway, it's brutally blunt writing.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U double-posted this 5 years ago, 38 seconds later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,111
@1,154,103 (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
> Which did you read? Were they worth reading? Im asking because one of his books is on sale and I'm wondering if I should buy
Which book is it?
> Which did you read? Were they worth reading? Im asking because one of his books is on sale and I'm wondering if I should buy
Which book is it?
tteh !MemesToDNA joined in and replied with this 5 years ago, 14 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,113
He was many things, but absolutely not pretentious.
tteh !MemesToDNA double-posted this 5 years ago, 39 seconds later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,114
@1,154,103 (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
If you want PDFs (or epub/mobi for an e-reader), I have almost everything he's written.
If you want PDFs (or epub/mobi for an e-reader), I have almost everything he's written.
(Edited 2 minutes later.)
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 12 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,119
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) double-posted this 5 years ago, 38 seconds later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,120
@1,154,114 (tteh !MemesToDNA)
I don't mind paying for books because everything on Kindle goes to my memory card, and I never have room on my phone
I don't mind paying for books because everything on Kindle goes to my memory card, and I never have room on my phone
(Edited 15 seconds later.)
Coil E. Leafeon !QnI1ArmPmY joined in and replied with this 5 years ago, 4 minutes later, 1 hour after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,121
'Some people never go crazy. What truly horrible lives they must lead.'
- Charles Bukowski
- Charles Bukowski
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 18 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,122
Anonymous F joined in and replied with this 5 years ago, 4 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,123
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU joined in and replied with this 5 years ago, 1 minute later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,124
jodie !foster2PAQ replied with this 5 years ago, 22 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,133
jodie !foster2PAQ double-posted this 5 years ago, 35 seconds later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,134
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U joined in and replied with this 5 years ago, 5 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,137
@1,154,119 (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
> It's called Women
No, skip that one, it's just an endless series of his squalid sexual encounters with women. It's the least great of his novels in my opinion. Seriously, start with Ham on Rye, and if you like that, check out the earlier 2 novels I mentioned.
> It's called Women
No, skip that one, it's just an endless series of his squalid sexual encounters with women. It's the least great of his novels in my opinion. Seriously, start with Ham on Rye, and if you like that, check out the earlier 2 novels I mentioned.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U double-posted this 5 years ago, 1 minute later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,138
@1,154,121 (Coil E. Leafeon !QnI1ArmPmY)
> 'Some people never go crazy. What truly horrible lives they must lead.'
> - Charles Bukowski
"The problem with the world is that the intelligent people are full of doubts, while the stupid ones are full of confidence" - Charles Bukowski. Highly relevant for our Trumpian/Brexiteer times.
> 'Some people never go crazy. What truly horrible lives they must lead.'
> - Charles Bukowski
"The problem with the world is that the intelligent people are full of doubts, while the stupid ones are full of confidence" - Charles Bukowski. Highly relevant for our Trumpian/Brexiteer times.
tteh !MemesToDNA replied with this 5 years ago, 6 minutes later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,140
tteh !MemesToDNA double-posted this 5 years ago, 1 minute later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,142
But yeah - what Merrin said. If you do read those two and enjoy them, give Factotum a go.
Anonymous F replied with this 5 years ago, 34 seconds later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,143
@1,154,140 (tteh !MemesToDNA)
No, that was actually a Kimmo quote. Taken out of context it sounds quite smart, but he originally said it to insult ISPs.
No, that was actually a Kimmo quote. Taken out of context it sounds quite smart, but he originally said it to insult ISPs.
Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU replied with this 5 years ago, 32 seconds later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,144
@1,154,140 (tteh !MemesToDNA)
Oh wow is our bert named after Bertrand Russell? Wouldn't surprise me. They have similar temperaments and intellects.
Oh wow is our bert named after Bertrand Russell? Wouldn't surprise me. They have similar temperaments and intellects.
Anonymous F replied with this 5 years ago, 1 minute later, 2 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,145
@previous (Fake anon !ZkUt8arUCU)
The only thing that will redeem mankind...Is cooperation..
And some grain alcohol..
The only thing that will redeem mankind...Is cooperation..
And some grain alcohol..
chill dog !!81dzJNNYL joined in and replied with this 5 years ago, 9 minutes later, 3 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,147
tteh !MemesToDNA replied with this 5 years ago, 59 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,178
@previous (chill dog !!81dzJNNYL)
Uploaded here: http://dl.free.fr/getfile.pl?file=/IlN2GmkO :) About 40, all epub, in a zip. There's a fair chance Absence of the Hero is corrupt; it won't open for me 50% of the time and I don't know why! But the rest are okay.
Uploaded here: http://dl.free.fr/getfile.pl?file=/IlN2GmkO :) About 40, all epub, in a zip. There's a fair chance Absence of the Hero is corrupt; it won't open for me 50% of the time and I don't know why! But the rest are okay.
(Edited 36 seconds later.)
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 30 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,192
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 5 years ago, 9 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,194
@previous (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
> I'm going to get Ham on Rye, but Im a bit afraid to read it
Why are you afraid to read it?
> I'm going to get Ham on Rye, but Im a bit afraid to read it
Why are you afraid to read it?
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 5 minutes later, 4 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,196
@previous (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
Because I have a history of disliking many books and you gave it such a glowing report
Because I have a history of disliking many books and you gave it such a glowing report
jodie !foster2PAQ replied with this 5 years ago, 18 minutes later, 5 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,201
@previous (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
i think bukowsko suckds Dick for Breakfast if that makes you feel any better
i think bukowsko suckds Dick for Breakfast if that makes you feel any better
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 5 years ago, 15 minutes later, 5 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,205
@1,154,196 (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
> Because I have a history of disliking many books and you gave it such a glowing report
But you'll have lost nothing except a little time if you end up not liking it. That's not something to fear.
> Because I have a history of disliking many books and you gave it such a glowing report
But you'll have lost nothing except a little time if you end up not liking it. That's not something to fear.
(Edited 18 seconds later.)
Anonymous J joined in and replied with this 5 years ago, 16 minutes later, 5 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,212
@previous (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
Losing time is the ONLY thing we have to fear. Time is all we have!
Losing time is the ONLY thing we have to fear. Time is all we have!
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 33 minutes later, 6 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,249
@1,154,201 (jodie !foster2PAQ)
@1,154,205 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
I'm reading a sample of it, and he has a peculiar way of writing
@1,154,205 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
I'm reading a sample of it, and he has a peculiar way of writing
tteh !MemesToDNA replied with this 5 years ago, 2 minutes later, 6 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,251
Green !StaYqkzUPc joined in and replied with this 5 years ago, 5 minutes later, 6 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,253
Does he have his own mug?
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 6 minutes later, 6 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,256
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 5 years ago, 18 minutes later, 6 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,265
@1,154,212 (J)
> Losing time is the ONLY thing we have to fear. Time is all we have!
If a pack of rabid dogs had cornered you in a dead end alleyway and were salivating as they inched towards you with razor-sharp teeth bared, you would not think the only thing to fear in this world is losing the few hours it takes to read a classic of 20th century American literature.
> Losing time is the ONLY thing we have to fear. Time is all we have!
If a pack of rabid dogs had cornered you in a dead end alleyway and were salivating as they inched towards you with razor-sharp teeth bared, you would not think the only thing to fear in this world is losing the few hours it takes to read a classic of 20th century American literature.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U double-posted this 5 years ago, 1 minute later, 6 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,266
@1,154,249 (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
> I'm reading a sample of it, and he has a peculiar way of writing
Don't bother with 'samples', just start from the start where he descibes being "under something" and struggles for the rest of his life to get out from under it.
> I'm reading a sample of it, and he has a peculiar way of writing
Don't bother with 'samples', just start from the start where he descibes being "under something" and struggles for the rest of his life to get out from under it.
Green !StaYqkzUPc replied with this 5 years ago, 26 minutes later, 7 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,279
chill dog !!81dzJNNYL replied with this 5 years ago, 3 minutes later, 7 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,284
@1,154,178 (tteh !MemesToDNA)
Thx bb
I went through a phase of really liking his poetry as a depressed high schooler but I've yet to read his books. And now that I'm moving into my own place I'll once again have a nice place to read.
Thx bb
I went through a phase of really liking his poetry as a depressed high schooler but I've yet to read his books. And now that I'm moving into my own place I'll once again have a nice place to read.
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 18 minutes later, 7 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,294
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 5 years ago, 11 minutes later, 7 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,296
@previous (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
> Im enjoying it
Glad to hear it. Let me know your opinion when you finish it.
> Im enjoying it
Glad to hear it. Let me know your opinion when you finish it.
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 22 minutes later, 8 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,300
@previous (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
I know that it's a novel, but it feels very real. I wonder if he had a hard life
I know that it's a novel, but it feels very real. I wonder if he had a hard life
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 5 years ago, 11 hours later, 19 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,406
@previous (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
> I know that it's a novel, but it feels very real. I wonder if he had a hard life
It's an account of his own childhood up to the age of about 20. It's a 'novel' in the sense that he adopts an alter ego (Henry Chinaski) but he's describing his own life and his relationship with his father, his discovery of alcohol and fighting, and his general disillusionment with people.
After you finish it go watch some Youtube interviews with him. Fascinating guy.
> I know that it's a novel, but it feels very real. I wonder if he had a hard life
It's an account of his own childhood up to the age of about 20. It's a 'novel' in the sense that he adopts an alter ego (Henry Chinaski) but he's describing his own life and his relationship with his father, his discovery of alcohol and fighting, and his general disillusionment with people.
After you finish it go watch some Youtube interviews with him. Fascinating guy.
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U double-posted this 5 years ago, 2 minutes later, 19 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,408
This is one of my favourite short interviews with him when he describes the worst hangover he ever had, and how being right about seeing a guy kill himself when his woman was doubting him made it better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLqY6NtWpqY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLqY6NtWpqY
tteh !MemesToDNA replied with this 5 years ago, 19 minutes later, 20 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,412
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 1 hour later, 21 hours after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,428
@1,154,408 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
I watched this and another one where he is very mean to his girlfriend Linda on camera. Sometimes his choices and impulse control issues confuse me, but I think that did he ever have a chance at acting decently, with his background?
I watched this and another one where he is very mean to his girlfriend Linda on camera. Sometimes his choices and impulse control issues confuse me, but I think that did he ever have a chance at acting decently, with his background?
Anonymous L joined in and replied with this 5 years ago, 8 hours later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,576
Bukowski was boring. Meh.
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 25 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,591
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 5 years ago, 8 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,594
@1,154,428 (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
> I watched this and another one where he is very mean to his girlfriend Linda on camera. Sometimes his choices and impulse control issues confuse me, but I think that did he ever have a chance at acting decently, with his background?
I know the clip you're talking about and while physical aggression towards a woman from a man is always wrong, I don't know that I'd call him "mean" to her in that clip. Linda knew exactly the reaction she wanted to get out of him, she knew from lengthy experience exactly how to get it out of him, and she got what she wanted.
As for his impulse control, I think that he did the best he could. People irritated him, he was like a literary George Carlin. As he wrote, "I don't hate people, I just feel better when they aren't around". He could be a very kind man but sooner or later people would identify his weaknesses and hen-peck him about them, as Linda does in that clip. If she were sensitive to the situation, she would have stopped needling him. She wanted him to explode on camera, and he did. Does it make his actions right? No, not at all. But by that point she knew exactly what would happen and she did it anyway.
> I watched this and another one where he is very mean to his girlfriend Linda on camera. Sometimes his choices and impulse control issues confuse me, but I think that did he ever have a chance at acting decently, with his background?
I know the clip you're talking about and while physical aggression towards a woman from a man is always wrong, I don't know that I'd call him "mean" to her in that clip. Linda knew exactly the reaction she wanted to get out of him, she knew from lengthy experience exactly how to get it out of him, and she got what she wanted.
As for his impulse control, I think that he did the best he could. People irritated him, he was like a literary George Carlin. As he wrote, "I don't hate people, I just feel better when they aren't around". He could be a very kind man but sooner or later people would identify his weaknesses and hen-peck him about them, as Linda does in that clip. If she were sensitive to the situation, she would have stopped needling him. She wanted him to explode on camera, and he did. Does it make his actions right? No, not at all. But by that point she knew exactly what would happen and she did it anyway.
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 59 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,606
@previous (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
I also feel like he didn't have a good sense of How people would react to his actions. He describes periodically being on the outs with his friends, and I get the sense that he sees no rhyme or reason to it. But then he'll be pointlessly aggressive it seems like. Maybe I don't understand it and what its like being abused as a child/ growing up in the ghetto
As for the Linda interview, he was doing a thing that I've seen many mean drunks do. You'll be conversing near them and they will run a low volume commentary that slowly gets more angry and more angry, all the while you're trying to keep up a seemingly normal patter
I also feel like he didn't have a good sense of How people would react to his actions. He describes periodically being on the outs with his friends, and I get the sense that he sees no rhyme or reason to it. But then he'll be pointlessly aggressive it seems like. Maybe I don't understand it and what its like being abused as a child/ growing up in the ghetto
As for the Linda interview, he was doing a thing that I've seen many mean drunks do. You'll be conversing near them and they will run a low volume commentary that slowly gets more angry and more angry, all the while you're trying to keep up a seemingly normal patter
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) double-posted this 5 years ago, 4 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,608
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 5 years ago, 17 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,612
@1,154,606 (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
> I also feel like he didn't have a good sense of How people would react to his actions. He describes periodically being on the outs with his friends, and I get the sense that he sees no rhyme or reason to it. But then he'll be pointlessly aggressive it seems like. Maybe I don't understand it and what its like being abused as a child/ growing up in the ghetto
> As for the Linda interview, he was doing a thing that I've seen many mean drunks do. You'll be conversing near them and they will run a low volume commentary that slowly gets more angry and more angry, all the while you're trying to keep up a seemingly normal patter
You make interesting and perceptive observations about mean drunks. I do think he lived on his impulses, you're right there. He was one of those people (common among those who grow up in frightening, unsafe and abusive households) who are very perceptive about others but perhaps not so much about themselves. When you spend so much of your formative years trying to predict the behaviour of others in order to protect yourself, you neglect your own development and self-discovery.
Where are you in the novel right now, is he dealing with his acne yet?
> I also feel like he didn't have a good sense of How people would react to his actions. He describes periodically being on the outs with his friends, and I get the sense that he sees no rhyme or reason to it. But then he'll be pointlessly aggressive it seems like. Maybe I don't understand it and what its like being abused as a child/ growing up in the ghetto
> As for the Linda interview, he was doing a thing that I've seen many mean drunks do. You'll be conversing near them and they will run a low volume commentary that slowly gets more angry and more angry, all the while you're trying to keep up a seemingly normal patter
You make interesting and perceptive observations about mean drunks. I do think he lived on his impulses, you're right there. He was one of those people (common among those who grow up in frightening, unsafe and abusive households) who are very perceptive about others but perhaps not so much about themselves. When you spend so much of your formative years trying to predict the behaviour of others in order to protect yourself, you neglect your own development and self-discovery.
Where are you in the novel right now, is he dealing with his acne yet?
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U double-posted this 5 years ago, 55 seconds later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,613
@1,154,608 (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
> Do you think he is autistic?
I doubt it to be honest. He's too observant for that, too gifted in describing the human experience in all its squalid misery.
> Do you think he is autistic?
I doubt it to be honest. He's too observant for that, too gifted in describing the human experience in all its squalid misery.
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 32 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,627
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 5 years ago, 27 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,637
@previous (Kook !!rcSrAtaAC)
> I am near the very end. They've just bombed Pearl Harbor
Ah damn, when he tells his friend to have the free drink offered to him for dying to protect for the prick's bar, and then tells him he's the best he's known (the best compliment that can ever be paid), it's one of the most poignant moments in American fiction for me.
Please be sure to give your final thoughts on the novel.
> I am near the very end. They've just bombed Pearl Harbor
Ah damn, when he tells his friend to have the free drink offered to him for dying to protect for the prick's bar, and then tells him he's the best he's known (the best compliment that can ever be paid), it's one of the most poignant moments in American fiction for me.
Please be sure to give your final thoughts on the novel.
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 9 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,644
@previous (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
I don't think that I am equipped to analyze a novel. I can say that I enjoyed reading it, even when not much was happening
Which book on this character comes after Beer? I've purchased two and want to start the right one
I don't think that I am equipped to analyze a novel. I can say that I enjoyed reading it, even when not much was happening
Which book on this character comes after Beer? I've purchased two and want to start the right one
(Edited 50 seconds later.)
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) double-posted this 5 years ago, 1 hour later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,726
Oh no. The sex scene is horrifying
Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U replied with this 5 years ago, 49 seconds later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,728
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) replied with this 5 years ago, 13 minutes later, 1 day after the original post[^] [v] #1,154,740
Kook !!rcSrAtaAC (OP) double-posted this 5 years ago, 1 day later, 2 days after the original post[^] [v] #1,155,237
I think this man should win a World's Record for holding the most jobs. I think it's 30 so far and Im not even halfway through the second book
Anonymous J replied with this 5 years ago, 3 days later, 6 days after the original post[^] [v] #1,156,499
@1,154,265 (Father Merrin !u5oFWxmY7U)
Don't tell me what I would think. For all you know I'm a braindead idiot who might very well think that
Don't tell me what I would think. For all you know I'm a braindead idiot who might very well think that